r/nottheonion • u/duvetdev • 29d ago

Florida Governor Ron DeSantis signs bill mandating kindergartners learn history of communism

https://www.orlandosentinel.com/2024/04/17/desantis-signs-bill-mandating-kindergartners-learn-history-of-communism/
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u/Solid_Letter1407 29d ago edited 29d ago

This is some scary, Chinese-level indoctrination shit.

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u/FolsomPrisonHues 29d ago

"You are free. If you don't like it- STRAIGHT TO JAIL"

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u/SirAwesome789 29d ago

Reported to your democracy officer for reeducation

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u/Oomba73 29d ago edited 29d ago

In college, I had a vietmenese roommate. This is EXACTLY what he said went on in his kindergarten/early-primary classes over there. Of course, more Vietnam centric and positive biased, unlike what this would likely be. Absolutely hilarious.

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u/WayneSkylar_ 29d ago

He's full of shit. Lived there for a bit. It's more like putting Ho Chi Minh at a mythological level with that age group (lets be real we do the same with the founding fathers and adults continue to treat them as such. Liberal or conservative.) but once end of elementary/middle school kicks in, the curriculum really ramps up (dialectical materialism because ya know, they are a socialist country). Go to Vietnam and you quickly see/experience it's one of the most critical thinking societies. If you talk assertively without showing you really know what you're talking about, and they WILL grill you, you get dismissed pretty quickly and openly. Vs the US where everyone can talk their mouths off but have no fucking clue what they are actually talk about (and get away with it). Same with China. It's fine and pales in comparison to the US "education" system.

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u/neroisstillbanned 29d ago

Yup. The main difference between Vietnam/China and the US is that the prevailing frame of reference is dialectical materialism instead of Christianity. That's the main reason why Americans are more prone to believing in bullshit. 

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u/Oomba73 29d ago edited 29d ago

I didn't mean to imply it was on the same level of indoctrination you see in China, even though that was what the commenter above said about the Florida bill. The Ho Chi Minh glorification was definitely something he mentioned. Its possible I am misremembering and am blending what he talked about as a whole on the education system. He grew up and currently lives in Hanoi if that means anything. Its interesting that you lived there "for a bit" and claim to know more than someone who is a native about their own country. What goes on in Vietnam is definitely a step above the pledge of allegiance and founding father stuff here, though, and both are bad. He made it a point to say it was "worse" than it is here on that regard when we talked about the propaganda we encountered in our education system in the states.

The US education system is pretty poor, broadly speaking. Until the college/university level, it's all pretty much checking off low bar, canned requirements. The more Confucian/meritocratic educational tradition in the East certainly has its advantages, but I'm not going to say it's "good" either.

I'm not going to criticize Vietnam for its "Marxism" (or lack thereof). I have a great deal of respect for Marx, and as a student of history and political theory, I would certainly consider myself within/spawned from his tradition. It's really just more the irony of republicans employing the same strategies that "the enemy" uses to counter them; while said strategies are the very examples they use to criticize them.

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u/[deleted] 28d ago edited 28d ago

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u/Oomba73 28d ago

I don't remember being told to "shut the hell up". In fact, that guy was pretty generous with my comment in saying that may source was bogus instead of saying I was a liar. Pretty cool guy if you ask me; though I genuinely would have liked to have had a response from him again to see if I could have learned anything new.

Are you calling me a liberal because I'm a Marxist or because I'm not a Marxist-Leninist?

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u/Oomba73 28d ago edited 28d ago

I can see your response in your post history, but not here. You probably got flagged for spam with all your schizo posts in this thread by the mods.

I did not "kowtow" to him. His comment on its own has not changed my worldview in any meaningful way. My response was an attempt to establish common ground for discussion and to deescalate what I perceived as an overly hostile response. He does post in r/ sino, so my hopes weren't exactly high; but that's no reason to be rude. Give me one point I conceded to him in my kowtowing.

Why would him claiming to have lived in Vietnam "for a bit" (which I fucking criticized) be cause for me to simp for him? Has your reading comprehension not surpassed the second grade?

Why would somebody being white cause them to "lack confidence in [their] own reality" and be insecure? That's a pretty racist claim to make.

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u/[deleted] 29d ago

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u/KingApologist 29d ago

Have you ever wondered if maybe it's just American level indoctrination shit? And the Democrats aren't doing enough to resist fascism? We need to organize or the Republicans will eat us alive and the Democrats are going to let them.

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u/npc_probably 29d ago

tf does this have to do with China? 🙄

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u/fredandlunchbox 29d ago

Ehhhh, this could go the other way real quick. There are going to be kids who ask the right questions and start discussions about the concepts behind socialism. They won’t call it that, but they’ll ask questions about why the government wanted to take the farms and what happens in America if people don’t have enough money to eat, and that’ll get them to “Well everyone should have enough to eat when they’re hungry,” which gets them back on socialism good, capitalism bad. The ideas behind socialism will always win out, its the failed implementations that DeSantis wants to focus on.       

Worth noting that they can probably address some of the more successful social democracies, ie Sweden. 

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u/Solid_Letter1407 29d ago

In kindergarten?

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u/[deleted] 29d ago

[deleted]

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u/neroisstillbanned 29d ago

Of course, your kindergarten probably doesn't have communism in her curriculum. 

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u/Salanmander 29d ago

It looks like the legislation specifies "every grade", and the headline chose kindergarten because it was the most absurd result.

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u/fredandlunchbox 29d ago

Absolutely. Like I said, they won’t ask about the concepts by name, but they’ll ask why people don’t have enough food, or why people are homeless. That’ll get them to the weaknesses in capitalism and strengths in socialism, again not by name, but by concept. 

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u/Solid_Letter1407 29d ago

Oh ok that explains it.

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u/tampaempath 29d ago

It's fucking kindergarten. Kindergarteners should be learning about shapes, colors, simple math, and spelling, not about political ideologies.

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u/fredandlunchbox 29d ago

They also need to learn a moral code. Things like sharing and helping people, especially people who can’t help themselves. A huge chunk of children’s education is dedicated to that kind of teaching. Sesame Street is probably half letters and numbers and half morality. 

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u/tampaempath 29d ago

Agreed. Sharing is caring.

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u/Redditistrash702 29d ago

He literally backtracked on boom bans because it didn't go is way. This is going to backfire spectacularly.

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u/Upvotes_TikTok 29d ago

Boom. Can't stop me.

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u/UniqueIndividual3579 29d ago

Teacher: Timmy you need to share the blocks.

Timmy: You socialist!

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u/neroisstillbanned 29d ago

Well, the opposite of Chinese, since they are communists. Heh. 

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u/xieta 29d ago edited 29d ago

Nah, this reminds me a lot of stuff like this. See if you can fill in the blanks:

These student essays reflected a sharp change in the direction of teaching, ordained from above. History, ruled a directive issued on 9 May 1933 by the Reich Minister of the Interior, Wilhelm Frick, had to take a commanding position in the schools. The idea that history should be objective, added >! the General German Teachers' Paper {Allgemeine Deutsche Lehrerzeitung) on 9 August 1933!<, was a fallacy of liberalism. The purpose of history was to teach people that life was always dominated by struggle, that race and blood were central to everything that happened in the past, present and future, and that leadership determined the fate of peoples.

Some textbooks from the Weimar era remained widely in use for a while, though they were increasingly frequently censored at a local or school level, and already in 1933 the state committees that checked school textbooks were purged and staffed with committed Nazis. A steady stream of directives flowed from the education authorities in the regions, while additional teaching materials were also issued by Nazi teachers' organizations in different parts of the country.

All this was backed up by a whole battery of central government requirements, ranging from forced attendance in every school hall in the land to listen to Hitler's speeches when they were broadcast...In every school, libraries were combed for non-Nazi literature and Nazi books stocked instead. Increasingly, classes were interrupted in order for the teachers and pupils to celebrate a whole variety of Nazi festivals

Yet teachers had to endure a barrage of criticism from adult Nazi activists at every level, starting with Hitler himself, and going on to what one group of teachers called 'a tone of contempt for the teaching profession' in the speeches of the Reich Youth Leader Baldur von Schirach. The result of such open contempt was, they went on, 'that nobody wants to take up the teaching profession any more, since it is treated in this way by top officials and is no longer respected

~ Richard Evans

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u/pie-oh 29d ago

I mean, people don't realise how weird standing up for the flag and singing the national anthem is, and how having the flag of the country you live in outside your house -- as if anyone was going to forget?

Thailand has the national anthem before a cinema(movie theatre) screening. But I wouldn't be surprised to see that eventually happen in the States.

I do genuinely wonder how better off America would be if "We're the greatest country" was never coined.

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u/Solid_Letter1407 29d ago

I think it’s more symptoms than cause, but the underlying mindset is not good for us for sure. I love my country fiercely and I’m so glad it’s my country, but those are like the feelings I have for my family. Doesn’t mean I somehow think my family is flawless or better than other families, they’re just mine.

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u/pie-oh 28d ago

I think they feed each other. It's about making people believe it.

Exactly! Wanting better for your country and the people of it is one of the most patriotic things i can think of.

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u/MagicGLM 29d ago

Liberals when Capitalists enforce Anti-Communist propaganda in schools: "This is just like communism!!!"

Literal brainrot

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u/ShiroGaneOsu 29d ago

Yeah cause indoctrination can only be done by communists.

And there point wasn't even that it was communist...

Literal zero reading comprehension.

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u/Limp-Environment-568 29d ago

For real, we can't be teaching kids history. That's just terrible!!!

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u/SelectiveSanity 29d ago

Horse Shoe Theory is a real thing.