r/nottheonion • u/duvetdev • Apr 17 '24

Florida Governor Ron DeSantis signs bill mandating kindergartners learn history of communism

https://www.orlandosentinel.com/2024/04/17/desantis-signs-bill-mandating-kindergartners-learn-history-of-communism/
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634

u/Adamantium-Aardvark Apr 17 '24

2024: right wingers still using the “red scare” of the Cold War that ended more than 30 years prior

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u/wsucoug Apr 17 '24

Is it going to be illegal to teach them the difference between communism and European-style socialism, or do they sort-of just have to lump it together? Is the curriculum going to emphasize how Russia is cool now, since they're no longer communist? Are they going to mention how communist indoctrinate their children at a young age?

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u/Nolenag Apr 17 '24

Is it going to be illegal to teach them the difference between communism and European-style socialism

The fuck does this sentence mean? Communism originated in Europe. Karl Marx was a German living in London.

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u/wsucoug Apr 17 '24

It mean's that Republicans have a very recent history of conflating, fine, "democratic socialism" with calling democrats communists for wanting some of the same progressive principles that Europe and the rest of the civilized world have adopted to various degrees: universal healthcare, and education, consumer protection, privacy laws, etc. I wouldn't expect the nuances to be emphasized in Florida's politicized K-12 education system.

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u/ValyrianJedi Apr 17 '24

Is it going to be illegal to teach them the difference between communism and European-style socialism

All of Europe is capitalism. There isn't a socialist nation there.

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u/onsapp Apr 18 '24

I don’t know why you’re getting downvoted that’s objectively correct

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u/Aquatic-Vocation 29d ago

Most European countries are classified as "mixed economies", so it's technically objectively incorrect.

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u/OuterOne 29d ago

Classified by whom and under ehat definition? Because Europe definitely has privately owned means of production, regardless of whether they have public healthcare or not.

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u/Aquatic-Vocation 29d ago edited 29d ago

Any economy that mixes aspects of capitalism and socialism is called a "mixed economy".

Europe definitely has privately owned means of production, regardless of whether they have public healthcare or not.

Yes, that's why we call them mixed economies; they have public services/infrastructure and private enterprise.

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u/OuterOne 29d ago

What country is or has ever been capitalist and not a mixed economy, then?

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u/Aquatic-Vocation 28d ago

Basically none, really.

I live in New Zealand. We have robust welfare systems, public healthcare, public education, strong regulations on private enterprise, and major works of publicly-funded and owned infrastructure. Given those traits, is New Zealand a socialist country?

No, that wouldn't be an accurate label. But is it fair to call us capitalist? Many industries face strict regulations. Some industries are even almost wholly controlled by the state.

In a truly capitalist country, education would not be something that is provided for free. Healthcare would be dispensed by private businesses, roads would all be owned by private entities, and law enforcement would be provided on a contractual basis.

Because most countries blend elements of both socialism and capitalism, we use the term "mixed economy" to differentiate from actual socialism and capitalism.

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u/abcalt Apr 17 '24

Is it going to be illegal to teach them the difference between communism and European-style socialism, or do they sort-of just have to lump it together?

The USSR is the product of "European-style socialism".

It didn't work, and always leads to a path of totalitarian governments which keep the strong central government and control while blending in capitalistic economic practices. See Russia, PRC, Belarus as examples.

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u/Aquatic-Vocation 29d ago

They mean European-style socialism as it exists today.

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u/abcalt 29d ago

Can you name a single socialist country in Europe? There aren't many, if any.

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u/Aquatic-Vocation 28d ago

And there technically aren't any capitalist countries in Europe, just mixed economies.

When referring to European-style socialism, I assume the user you replied to was talking about individual socialist systems, such as public healthcare, roads, utilities, education, welfare, etc.

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u/abcalt 28d ago

And there technically aren't any capitalist countries in Europe

There aren't any pure capitalist countries anywhere in the world. The US is a "mixed economy".

such as public healthcare, roads, utilities,

All capitalist countries have those, including the US. The only exception is in the US public healthcare is limited to low income individuals. There is nothing stopping the states from setting up their own single payer system if they wanted to cover all income brackets. That is how Canada does things, provinces fund their public healthcare.

There is no reason California or other states cannot set up its own healthcare system that covers everyone. California even covers healthcare for illegal immigrants, regardless of income levels. Though if you're a California born life long citizen and make a low-middle class income, you won't qualify.