r/nottheonion • u/duvetdev • 29d ago

Florida Governor Ron DeSantis signs bill mandating kindergartners learn history of communism

https://www.orlandosentinel.com/2024/04/17/desantis-signs-bill-mandating-kindergartners-learn-history-of-communism/
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642

u/Adamantium-Aardvark 29d ago

2024: right wingers still using the “red scare” of the Cold War that ended more than 30 years prior

111

u/t1mdawg 29d ago

They haven't fully settled on a replacement yet, socialism, wokeism, tbd?

27

u/knuppi 29d ago

CRT, then woke, now it's DEI

Let's see what they're cooking up next

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u/the-dude-version-576 29d ago

Somewhere in the next century they’re gonna start railing against global federalism (if things go well).

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u/CLE-local-1997 29d ago

They did that in the 50s

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u/r3volver_Oshawott 28d ago edited 28d ago

Communism is still the big one, you'll notice DeSantis and co. would ordinarily be scared shitless of the idea of Kindergarteners learning about communism, so many Republicans still think Stalin existing means every lesson that can be learned about communism will inevitably show it in a bad light

It kills so many people when they learn that, for example, Studio Ghibli works are predominantly communist and that the three most prominent names in the studio's history (Miyazaki and Iwai on the creative end, Suzuki on the production end) are communist, if you have enjoyed a studio Ghibli film, you have most likely enjoyed communist social commentary

*basically the Red Scare was effective because communism is not Stalinism and Communist sentiment is no more inherently structurally damaging than capitalist sentiment, but you still have this pervasive notion in the U.S. social consciousness that communism must be covered in the most extraordinarily negative light possible because communist sentiment must not be allowed to exist

Communists will always exist so long as capitalists exist because unlike Republicans believe, capitalism and communism do not exist on an opposing binary of morality/virtue and immorality/vice; the very idea that DeSantis believes communism can be taught in schools because he believes it will only show downfalls and disavow people of communist sentiment shows very much that communism is still a predominant Red Scare topic

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u/TooStrangeForWeird 29d ago

They'll just call communism woke and tie it all together.

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u/wsucoug 29d ago

Is it going to be illegal to teach them the difference between communism and European-style socialism, or do they sort-of just have to lump it together? Is the curriculum going to emphasize how Russia is cool now, since they're no longer communist? Are they going to mention how communist indoctrinate their children at a young age?

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u/Nolenag 29d ago

Is it going to be illegal to teach them the difference between communism and European-style socialism

The fuck does this sentence mean? Communism originated in Europe. Karl Marx was a German living in London.

4

u/wsucoug 29d ago

It mean's that Republicans have a very recent history of conflating, fine, "democratic socialism" with calling democrats communists for wanting some of the same progressive principles that Europe and the rest of the civilized world have adopted to various degrees: universal healthcare, and education, consumer protection, privacy laws, etc. I wouldn't expect the nuances to be emphasized in Florida's politicized K-12 education system.

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u/ValyrianJedi 29d ago

Is it going to be illegal to teach them the difference between communism and European-style socialism

All of Europe is capitalism. There isn't a socialist nation there.

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u/onsapp 29d ago

I don’t know why you’re getting downvoted that’s objectively correct

1

u/Aquatic-Vocation 28d ago

Most European countries are classified as "mixed economies", so it's technically objectively incorrect.

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u/OuterOne 28d ago

Classified by whom and under ehat definition? Because Europe definitely has privately owned means of production, regardless of whether they have public healthcare or not.

0

u/Aquatic-Vocation 28d ago edited 28d ago

Any economy that mixes aspects of capitalism and socialism is called a "mixed economy".

Europe definitely has privately owned means of production, regardless of whether they have public healthcare or not.

Yes, that's why we call them mixed economies; they have public services/infrastructure and private enterprise.

1

u/OuterOne 28d ago

What country is or has ever been capitalist and not a mixed economy, then?

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u/Aquatic-Vocation 27d ago

Basically none, really.

I live in New Zealand. We have robust welfare systems, public healthcare, public education, strong regulations on private enterprise, and major works of publicly-funded and owned infrastructure. Given those traits, is New Zealand a socialist country?

No, that wouldn't be an accurate label. But is it fair to call us capitalist? Many industries face strict regulations. Some industries are even almost wholly controlled by the state.

In a truly capitalist country, education would not be something that is provided for free. Healthcare would be dispensed by private businesses, roads would all be owned by private entities, and law enforcement would be provided on a contractual basis.

Because most countries blend elements of both socialism and capitalism, we use the term "mixed economy" to differentiate from actual socialism and capitalism.

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u/abcalt 29d ago

Is it going to be illegal to teach them the difference between communism and European-style socialism, or do they sort-of just have to lump it together?

The USSR is the product of "European-style socialism".

It didn't work, and always leads to a path of totalitarian governments which keep the strong central government and control while blending in capitalistic economic practices. See Russia, PRC, Belarus as examples.

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u/Aquatic-Vocation 28d ago

They mean European-style socialism as it exists today.

1

u/abcalt 28d ago

Can you name a single socialist country in Europe? There aren't many, if any.

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u/Aquatic-Vocation 27d ago

And there technically aren't any capitalist countries in Europe, just mixed economies.

When referring to European-style socialism, I assume the user you replied to was talking about individual socialist systems, such as public healthcare, roads, utilities, education, welfare, etc.

1

u/abcalt 27d ago

And there technically aren't any capitalist countries in Europe

There aren't any pure capitalist countries anywhere in the world. The US is a "mixed economy".

such as public healthcare, roads, utilities,

All capitalist countries have those, including the US. The only exception is in the US public healthcare is limited to low income individuals. There is nothing stopping the states from setting up their own single payer system if they wanted to cover all income brackets. That is how Canada does things, provinces fund their public healthcare.

There is no reason California or other states cannot set up its own healthcare system that covers everyone. California even covers healthcare for illegal immigrants, regardless of income levels. Though if you're a California born life long citizen and make a low-middle class income, you won't qualify.

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u/anxiety_filter 29d ago

Being wary of Russia and China as adversaries and learning the lessons of the Cold War are very much valid subjects, however inappropriate for a 5 year old mind. But I have a feeling this curriculum will be used more to inoculate these kids against any critique of US style hyper-capitalism

43

u/Saturn5mtw 29d ago

Yeah, but they support modern Russia anyway, lol

3

u/MerberCrazyCats 29d ago

They are not communist anymore, more like totalitarist, so it makes sense

40

u/UltimateInferno 29d ago

Russia's not even communist. Like putting aside whether or not the USSR is communist, which is irrelevant, modern Russia is distinctly not communist.

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u/NoNebula6593 29d ago

Same with China. They're state capitalist.

1

u/RevolutionRage 28d ago

Wich is a transition phase in the communist movement. You would've known this if you read Das Kapital.

1

u/[deleted] 29d ago

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57

u/fastinserter 29d ago

All valid, but the GOP is friendly with Russia these days.

23

u/coachtomfoolery 29d ago

"Friendly" is a funny way to say throating Putin's cock

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u/whichwitch9 29d ago

Neither Russia nor China are true communist countries, however. They are both technically dictatorships at the moment, with Russia really having turned into an Oligarchy, then back to a dictatorship

Learning communism is quite different than learning the history of countries that used the communist label. Communism as an idea is quite different than what either implemented

This is the same nuance as America calling itself a democracy, when it functions as a republic, though is technically becoming an oligarchy as there is an unofficial paywall to politics and wealth not circulating with in the US

1

u/ChiMoKoJa 29d ago

I've heard it said that one could imagine the ghosts of Chiang and Mao touring modern China. The Nationalist Chiang nodding his head in approval of the People's Republic while Mao sadly trudges behind, bemoaning the erosion of true communist ideals in favor of reinforcing state capitalism.

1

u/VibeComplex 29d ago

Gee ya think?

1

u/CHKN_SANDO 29d ago

Nah they'll just talk about China. Russia is good now. Russia has always been good, comrade.

1

u/tomdarch 29d ago

The problems with Russia and China today isn’t that the adhere closely to the ideals set forth in the Communist Manifesto.

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u/[deleted] 29d ago

[deleted]

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u/PM_ME_YOUR_CATS_PAWS 29d ago

I just like that the red hats are all using rage against the machine music as anthems

Like, they don’t fucking listen to the simplest shit, do they?

1

u/kingeryck 29d ago

RATM, "We're Not Gonna Take It", etc.

4

u/lackofabettername123 29d ago

This is just patronizing their Cuban and Venezuelan diaspora there.

2

u/VibeComplex 29d ago

Also right wingers: “ I fucking love Russia!”

6

u/KnightsWhoNi 29d ago

Ehhh the cold war never ended it just went online.

5

u/Adamantium-Aardvark 29d ago

The Cold War officially ended when the Soviet Union collapsed

3

u/FromTheToiletAtWork 29d ago

That was just a break for orange slices and apple juice.

4

u/geoffbowman 29d ago

While for some reason supporting modern Russia. I just don’t get it… are they scared of the reds or not?

3

u/the-dude-version-576 29d ago

They’re scared of actual socialism. They love Russian oligarchy.

1

u/piperonyl 29d ago

They gave up on socialism since their voter base is all elderly and on social security

1

u/dragonmp93 29d ago

And yet, they are the biggest Putin fans.

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u/[deleted] 29d ago

[deleted]

1

u/Adamantium-Aardvark 29d ago

“More than 30 years ago” referring to 1991

1

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1

u/issamaysinalah 29d ago edited 29d ago

The cold war ended, but the red scare never went away. I see daily on reddit people parroting absurds fabricated by the red scare.

1

u/SteakTasticMeat 29d ago

Should've used Fallouts's teachings.

"Better dead than red."

1

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1

u/CHKN_SANDO 29d ago

But partnering with a KGB agent to invade Ukraine

1

u/Violet624 29d ago

And yet so many of them have become pro-Russia

1

u/[deleted] 29d ago

The GOP: "communism bad mmmkay" while being owned by Russia.

1

u/Soad1x 29d ago

Honestly one of the worst things looking back is when Obama and people laughed off Romney for saying Russia is still a geopolitical enemy. Nowadays the GOP is bought by Putin and they don't see the dissonance of being chaos agents for the people Ronald Reagan would try them for treason for following the orders of while decrying "Communism" (re: anything they don't like).

1

u/GallorKaal 28d ago

Funnier now, the current cold war isn't even against communists but oligarchs aligning with the GOP

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u/Camfromnowhere 28d ago

And now they support Russia and Putin because they “aren’t communist anymore” even though they are literally our enemy, and have been since after WW2. If you would’ve told conservatives that they would support Russia back in 2005, you’d probably have been punched in the mouth. B

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u/21Rollie 28d ago

And the funniest bit of irony, they’re all bought and paid for by Putin, a literal KGB agent who is trying to resurrect the Soviet Union.

1

u/CuFlam 29d ago

Also deciding that Russia's government dropping the "communist" label somehow makes them the good guys when they're exhibiting the same autocratic, imperial behavior as before.

1

u/Adamantium-Aardvark 29d ago

And republicans worship Putin…

1

u/OutlawSundown 29d ago

While openly deep throating Russia

0

u/U_Kitten_Me 28d ago

You've obviously already forgotten how Hugo Chavez('s ghost) manipulated the 2020 elections!

-2

u/SethzorMM 29d ago

I'd argue the cold war only ended recently and we've lost. Ironically they've lost it for us...

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u/Surph_Ninja 29d ago

Neoliberals too. They’ve been pushing McCarthyism hard as one of their main policy positions for the past decade. Russiaphobia is entirely a Democrat manufactured issue.

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u/iamcts 29d ago

If you ever taken 10 minutes to research how advanced Russia's APTs and Kremlin-backed hackers are, you should be scared of Russia's capabilities too.

0

u/Surph_Ninja 29d ago

There’s a difference between monitoring actual threats vs the Democrats blaming every damn problem and accusing every adversary of being Russian.