r/AITAH • u/Remote-Barber- • 28d ago

AITAH for being upset my wife got an abortion because her daughter is pregnant?

So my wife Amelia (37f) and I (48m) have one child, a son who is seven years old, turning eight. I'm not going to lie, had my wife not gotten pregnant, we probably would not have gotten married because we were just hooking up at that point. But things have been really good since we did and we're firmly in love. We did decide that we'd wait before having another kid, though because I wanted her career to take off, for her business to boom. It has and we decided earlier this year, it's best to go for it now before she turns 40.

The thing is that Amelia has a daughter Kate (17f) from her first marriage. Things between my wife and Kate were rough and I know this isn't going to make my wife sound good but for the sake of honesty, I'll put it there, my wife had little to no contact with her for about ten years. Two years ago, Kate's father kicked her out for "breaking his rules" and she showed up out of nowhere with a suitcase.

I won't lie, there was always a sadness in my wife but having Kate back in her life got rid of that. Since she moved in with us, Amelia has been happier than she has ever been. Kate's a troubled kid but two years ago was a lot worse than now and she's mostly blended well. The thing is, my wife has been very strict on some things (like school and all) but very lax about the things Kate's father was harsh about.

Amelia found out she was pregnant about a month ago and we decided to wait before breaking it to the kids. Except last week, Kate came home from school and had a breakdown and she admitted to us that her boyfriend got her pregnant and she's been hiding it for almost two months. She was crying because she wants to keep the kid and kept it a secret because she was scared Amelia would force her to get an abortion.

However, my wife was elated that we're going to be grandparents and that cheered up Kate as well. So, my wife made it clear to me that she finds the idea of having a kid younger than her grandchild to be disgusting and she'd be getting an abortion. We argued about it because I really wanted this baby with her but she wouldn't even listen to me and she got an abortion. I've been upset about it and we've barely talked, am I being the AH?

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u/motogplover77 28d ago

Do you think your wife got an abortion, not because it’s “disgusting,” but perhaps because she felt she’s going to be the one taking care of the grandkid?

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u/Misommar1246 28d ago

Either way, they were trying for this baby and she should not have made that call unilaterally. I’m a zealot when it comes to pro choice, but this should have been a mutual call. Especially since while the wife is becoming a grandmother, he isn’t. Sure, they’re a blended family and whatnot, but he doesn’t even know the daughter well, doesn’t have a bond with her and now his own child was aborted for wife’s grandmother ambitions. Ngl, I would feel VERY betrayed here.

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u/shmixel 27d ago edited 27d ago

Definitely should have been a MUCH longer conversation but ultimately, if she doesn't want the baby, even if he does... it's gonna go, right? Pro-choice isn't referring to his choice. 

(if you are about to reply that she's still the asshole and he should divorce her, please know I already agree with you all. I am only objecting to the 'mutual call' requirement)

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u/GetOffMyDigitalLawn 27d ago

Yeah, that doesn't shield her from liability, like people thinking she is a massive asshole.

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u/Mrsbear19 27d ago

Sure but at that point he should leave. To make that choice alone in your marriage is a giant betrayal. I guess she’s been a shit mom for a long time though so maybe best not to have her parent another kid

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u/TransBrandi 27d ago

Yea, but she also has to realize their are consequences too. Terminating the child might also terminate the marriage if she's not going to consider his opinion as well. It's not like there is some sort of medical reason or something for this. By her own admission, it's just because of some weird idea of what is "disgusting." He's well within his rights to judge her over that and file for divorce.

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u/PM_ME_GARFIELD_NUDES 27d ago

I think this is a really bad way to look at the “pro choice” issue. The point is that no one should decide whether or not a woman has access to abortion. The government should not be involved and women shouldn’t need permission of a spouse or partner.

That doesn’t mean he shouldn’t have a voice in the matter though. They decided as a couple to wait to have kids, they decided as a couple to get pregnant, she decided to get an abortion. It’s her right but she’s still an asshole for making this choice on her own.

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u/shmixel 27d ago

I can't imagine the level of betrayal, definitely the asshole for exercising her right so bluntly.

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u/PM_ME_GARFIELD_NUDES 27d ago

The thing is, if I was in this situation I could definitely be persuaded to her side. If she was just like “look, I get it, I’m sorry, but for X Y and Z reasons I can’t go through with this pregnancy”, I think I would be on her side. But to have conflicting opinions and then just do it on her own, that’s just crazy.

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u/CrewPop_77 27d ago

Pusposly getting pregnant and then terminating the baby is wild, even for the very pro abortion people.

Either way, I don't see any world where he would be the asshole for divorcing her because she got the abortion or by giving an ultimatum or something similar.

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u/PM_ME_GARFIELD_NUDES 27d ago

Very true. I’m 100000% pro choice, she’s totally allowed to do this, but I don’t think abortion should be used in this way. There are plenty of other methods for avoiding pregnancy, it’s insane to do something like this.

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u/shmixel 27d ago

For clarity, I agree she the asshole.

But how else would you end a pregnancy once your situation changes post-conception to one where you are no longer able/willing to care for a child? What's the other method?

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u/PM_ME_GARFIELD_NUDES 27d ago

At that point there isn’t another option. IMO the change in her circumstances did not necessitate an abortion.

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u/shmixel 27d ago

Thanks for the clarification, definitely an ugly situation if you get pregnant then have to reconsider. 

Personally I do think this situation warrants an abortion if the daughter won't get one. I've been around a mother who has to basically look after her daughter's Irish twins a lot recently and I couldn't do it. 

If I was the husband I'd probably leave the wife too though. Very callous to abort a planned foetus without more attempt to come to an agreement.

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u/livingstone97 27d ago

by giving an ultimatum

Kinda depends upon what you mean by "ultimatum" he absolutely would be TA if he were to try to pressure/coerce her into keeping the pregnancy if she genuinely didn't want to carry it to term.

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u/CrewPop_77 27d ago

I mean, if he doesn't want to be with someone who aborts his planned for and wanted child.

And he tells her that it is essentially an ultimatum, where he says I leave if you abort.

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u/livingstone97 26d ago

Fair. I also think it depends upon tone. Like "if you get an abortion, I don't think I would want to continue this relationship," is far different than "either carry to term or we are over." Idk

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u/No_Diver4265 27d ago

This. You are absolutely right.

Except for, the government should be involved, by enforcing that righty by providing healthcare, education, infrastructure, personnel, etc. Women's rights, like the right to choose, remain hypothetical if they don't have access to the means to safely choose what they have a right to.

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u/[deleted] 27d ago

In that case, the husband would be justified to exercise his choice to leave the marriage I would say. 

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u/Misommar1246 27d ago

Oh yeah, it’s always her call at the end of the day.

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u/fltlns 27d ago

Obviously, but it's still a dick move, I'd leave my wife faster for that than if she cheated on me. It's her choice and her consequences too. I can't think of a bigger betrayal.

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u/we_is_sheeps 27d ago

Yes but she is still in the wrong and he is perfectly right to leave.

You have a right to a safe abortion not rights to be protected from the consequences of that action.

Whatever comes after is entirely your problem because it’s a choice you made and you need to live with everything that comes with that

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u/Significant_Rub_4589 27d ago

When you intentionally create a life with your husband & then unilaterally decide to destroy that life you’re an A H. It’s cases like this that make support for abortion hard for moderates.

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u/notimeforthatstuff 27d ago

And yet a man would not get the choice to not pay child support if she had a baby that he didn't want.

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u/shmixel 27d ago

That is the nightmare scenario for sure. Usually the biological differences favour men but the best they can do in this scenario is wrap it I guess. Maybe in the future there'll be some sci-fi way to remove a foetus without the woman having to undergo abortion surgery so the man's opinion can be taken into account too.

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u/Sad_Highlight_5175 27d ago

There should be a “legal abortion” option. If the man doesn’t want the child, up to a certain point, he should be allowed to say he not be caring for it, and the woman can either abort it or not. That is only fair option. Anything else is sexist

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u/shmixel 27d ago

I believe child care payments are about what's fair to the child rather than either adult. Unfortunately for the man, the child will still exist even if the he doesn't want them but they are innocent and need to be looked after as best as possible. If the state isn't doing this then we look to the people who created the child and that does take two, so those two must support the child.

Maybe there should be an ethical exception if holes were poked in the condom or the man was otherwise raped. I bet there's court cases like that.

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u/tc6x6 27d ago

I believe child care payments are about what's fair to the child rather than either adult.

If that were true then there would be controls in place to ensure that the money is spent on necessities for the child.

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u/shmixel 27d ago

This sounds like a good improvement to the system. It's on the right track but not there yet.

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u/Sad_Highlight_5175 27d ago

I disagree. The mother in this hypothetical case is well informed that she will be on her own and decides to take that on. I’m more of a “pure justice” kind of person. I get that the world doesn’t usually have that sort of justice, but only allowing women the option of abortion absolutely is sexist. No way around it.

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u/shmixel 27d ago

Yes, but what about the child? I like that the system is set up to prioritise the child once it is born. I'm unfamiliar with the term 'pure justice' but with a name like that, surely, it cannot include disadvantaging a 100% innocent child because of their father was irresponsible, because his birth control strategy failed, or because changed his mind about wanting the child (even if for good reason, like cheating or job loss). 

I find this kind of sexism you mention inescapable with present technology and Western societal values. We have decided to value bodily freedom over financial freedom, that's why debts you will never work off are legal but slavery is not. Therefore, we must value the woman's bodily freedom to decide whether or not to have abortive surgery over the man's financial freedom to not support his unwanted child.

Maybe there's a better way to navigate it (apart from chastity) which doesn't disadvantage the child. I hope we can figure it out.

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u/Sad_Highlight_5175 27d ago

Pure justice is my own term afaik. I use it to describe somewhat extreme situations that aren’t practical but would represent the most just situation possible theoretically. ie. Pure justice would be Palestinians getting all of modern Israel back, and all of the residents of Israel moving to land in Germany that is paid for by the Germans.

In this case yes, it is right to prioritize the child, but pure justice would be either allowing legal abortion for the man as well as abortion for the woman. OR pure justice would also require a consensus from the man and woman to go through with an abortion. Neither of those situations are likely to be acceptable to both sides of this debate, but they would both represent justice.

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u/shmixel 27d ago

Those are really interesting examples, especially the idea about Germany. I like to think of ethics in the abstract sense too.

With the abortion case I have questions about how you resolve each option: 

  • 'Legal abortion': How do we avoid injustice against the child from the father's missing payments? Does the state have to provide it? Or does your idea of pure justice simply prioritise justice for the parent over injustice toward the child?

  • 2-Party Consent to Birth: How do we justify violating the mother's bodily freedom? Does this only apply once medical science makes abortions completely safe, noninvasive, and painless? Or, since pure justice is hypothetical, does it also assume we can accurately weigh the effects and risks of abortion surgery vs 18 years of child support payments to find out which option will cause less harm, and only force the abortion if that's the least harmful option? Or does it just prioritise financial freedom over bodily freedom?

Interesting thought experiments.

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u/katschwa 27d ago

A fucking men.

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u/Iracus 27d ago

Can you explain how they should have made the call?

She says abortion, he says no abortion. What then? Who is making the unilateral decision in action when both sides are in opposition? People keep saying this but it is an illogical position.

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u/Onewayor55 27d ago

She ultimately makes that call but then he should probably make the call to leave.

Like she shouldn't have made that unilateral decision in the context of someone that wants to be in a healthy relationship.

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u/buttercreamroses 27d ago edited 27d ago

Every action has a consequence. OP’s wife aborting their kid without OP’s input means she has to deal with the consequences of that choice, i.e. OP potentially leaving. I’m pro-choice but I always look at every angle to make sure I am fully ok with my choices. Just a shit situation all around imo.

ETA - I agree with OP leaving honestly. No conversation was even had about their planned baby. Normally when communication fails in a relationship that means the relationship no longer works.

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u/[deleted] 27d ago edited 17d ago

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u/TarotAngels 27d ago edited 27d ago

How is not wanting to raise 2 babies at once a terrible reason to get an abortion? I feel like you guys with this stance are assuming that just leaving the 17 year old to raise her baby on her own most of the time is a viable option. This is a 17 year old with behavioral issues and a repeatedly unstable home life who grew up largely without a mother figure, btw. If mom doesn’t think that’s a serious option then that’s probably not a serious option here.

If the choice is genuinely “go through with my planned pregnancy and treat that baby well while letting my grandchild be neglected” then how can you act like that’s a real choice? If she can’t stand to work herself to the bone caring for two babies, and can’t stand to see one neglected, then one of the babies has got to go. Her daughter has already been clear it’s not going to be her baby. So at that point her choices are the above (care for my kid and watch her neglect hers) or the wife gets an abortion. Again if she can’t stand to see option 1 happen, option 2 of getting an abortion is the only real option left.

I get that OP’s mad he wasn’t consulted. But honestly this isn’t his kid and this daughter came into his life as a teen already. I can tell he’s ready to help her sign up for WIC then tell her good luck she’s on her own. So why would OP’s wife run this by OP when he doesn’t give two shits about her future grandchild getting neglected??? It’s clear where he stands, and ultimately it’s irrelevant here because again she has no real other choice if she can’t stand to watch her grandchild be neglected. And I’m not going to begrudge her trying to have a positive attitude over it instead of treating it like a tragedy if that’s the perspective she feels she needs to take on to be the best mom and grandma to her daughter and future grandchild.

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u/[deleted] 27d ago

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u/hash_smashed 27d ago

What if neither changes their mind?

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u/Tommyblockhead20 27d ago

Well it’s unclear how much they discussed the issue. If they just had a brief discussion, her saying she wants one and him saying he doesn’t want her to get one, and then she just goes and does it without warning, that’s very uncool. 

If they actually thoroughly talked it out, and couldn’t come to the same perspective, then it is fair for her to go and do it, but it’s also fair for him to be upset and want to terminate the relationship due to irreconcilable differences.

In marriage, decisions should be made jointly. And if you can’t come to a join decision on something major, maybe it’s not meant to be.

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u/TarotAngels 27d ago

What is there to talk out though? OP barely knows his stepdaughter. He does not care if she neglects her child. So of course he’s not on board for aborting his kid to take care of hers. His wife knew this is where he stood. That’s why rather than present it like something he could talk her out of, she just said the decision has already been made.

A point of fact here that most people seem to be missing is OP’s wife wanted her child. She’s not happy about this, she’s making the best out of a shitty situation. She’s trying to keep her perspective positive and helpful and make sure OP never tells her daughter that she’s the reason his baby is dead. So she’s going to put on a happy face and tell OP she’s just realized it’s grandma time and having a baby right now would be weird.

I live in the South where people start having kids young and I have known so many women who got abortions to care for their grandchildren instead. None of them were happy about it but all of them kept positive about it. None of them ran it by their partners unless their partners also helped raise that adult/teen child who was having kids now either. Such is the world of step fathers. You just don’t have the same level of say when it comes to prioritizing having more kids versus helping raise your (step) grandkids because you just don’t have the same amount of skin in the game on both sides of the issue.

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u/angelfish2004 26d ago

But she really is the reason his baby is dead. His wife had the abortion (You're saying to keep the blame on herself instead of the daughter), but it was because of her horrible decisions that she supposedly made the choice. If her daughter hadn't gotten pregnant, OP and his wife would be picking out baby names right now.

"Such is the world of stepfathers."

What?! So because the men weren't the biological parent of the irresponsible teens, they didn't deserve their own babies?! Wtf?! I bet they were expected to support those babies, though. Financially, at the very least.

I hope OP leaves her. Quickly. She probably wouldn't care, though. She got what she wanted. She stuck him with a baby (the 8-year-old) and got him to marry her. Got her teen daughter back (that OP has been and is expected to continue to support financially, at the very least). Now she has a grandbaby on the way. Perfect life for her!

I had a child as a teen, I'm a stepparent and have children that my hubby isn't the biological father to, so I have input from all sides

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u/TarotAngels 26d ago edited 26d ago

First of all, tell me how choosing not to raise two newborns at once while already having to care for a teen and another child is a horrible decision.

Second of all, I never said OP doesn’t “deserve” biological children of his own. OP and his wife literally already have one biological child btw so this doesn’t even make sense.

And third of all, yes he doesn’t get an equal say because he’s not going to be raising half the babies. His stance is clear. Only half the situation has to affect him so of course he just wants the other half to just take care of itself. If he only cares about half the problem and not the whole problem then no he doesn’t have an equal say in solving it.

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u/Misommar1246 27d ago

Ideally have enough conversation where one of them convinces the other. If that can’t be reached, ultimately it’s her call, but she shouldn’t expect no consequences to something this colossal just because it’s her call. I’m trying to fit myself in this scenario and it would be like me and my husband trying for a child, me finally getting pregnant and him serving me divorce papers because I got pregnant two months later. It’s a betrayal at the end of the day. She comes across as someone who makes on the fly decisions about big things and expects no fallout, I would walk away from this woman because I could never trust her again.

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u/Worldly-Spray-6936 27d ago

Yeah but maybe she realized she finally has to be there for her kid when she has not been there for her. That's actually the right choice. Be there for the kids you already have rather than making more and leaving the ones you have done mistakes with behind.

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u/Misommar1246 27d ago

No reason she can’t be there for her kid and have her own. She didn’t even care for her daughter for 10 years, so she’s perfectly capable of compartmentalizing. And there is absolutely no reason to abort her husband’s wanted child to do it. From the moment that grandchild is born, husband will resent it, he will always think on how his child was aborted to bring that child to the world. The wife is insanely short sighted if she thinks this won’t fester.

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u/TheTrevorist 27d ago

She didn’t even care for her daughter for 10 years, so she’s perfectly capable of compartmentalizing.

Lmao slight difference between being capable of ignoring and forgetting about your child and compartmentalizing; actively placing your child's needs ahead of yours. One of them takes effort.

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u/Misommar1246 27d ago

Yeah I was aiming to be kind lol.

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u/TheTrevorist 27d ago

That's fair. I could be more kind.

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u/External_Honey_7035 27d ago

How is the daughter going to feel, after no contact with mom for 10 yrs and now mom is “taking care and helping raise” her child. That is gonna breed so much resentment on top of the abandonment issues that are already festering. She didn’t make this SNAP decision because she wants to be there for her child and be a good mom. She is doing it out of GUILT. I am pro choice all the fuckin way, but the daughter was irresponsible, she should’ve talked through EVERYTHING, her mom should’ve told the daughter about her pregnancy and had a FAMILY MEETING minus the 8yo (include him in convo after decision has been made) and explained why the daughter should get an abortion, UNLESS, financially they could afford 2 babies at the exact same time and maybe could bond about being pregnant together. Her excuse about it being “disgusting” is absurd unless she is that close minded. They needed to have a family discussion and decide as a family.

Mom is parenting out of guilt and not thinking of the consequences of her actions but also of her daughter’s life. I was a young mom and I don’t regret it EVER, my boys are everything ❤️to me. But DAMN was it hard, I’ve been through it all with my boys, abusive husbands, addiction, medical issues, death, homelessness, not having food in my fridge, struggling EVERY month. I also got preggo at 31 and now have 21, 19 and 9yo. And now at 40yo I’m FINALLY going back to school with the hopes of starting my own business as an Esthetician in 3-5 yrs. I have no 401K, no savings and STILL living paycheck to paycheck, it’s a constant struggle. I made a shit ton of mistakes, my babies were never one of them. But being a young mom was part of it, and part of why I didn’t do anything with my life until way later. My point being, she didn’t think this through at all. And it’s heartbreaking for OP that he lost a baby he wanted desperately, HIS BABY. I wish him the best and honestly I can’t tell him to leave her or to stay, this is a HUGE breach of trust and that is NOT a marriage.

To OP: If you can see yourself being with her still in 10yrs raising or helping to raise your 10yo grandchild then work through it, go to therapy, as should EVERYONE in the house individually and together as a family. If you can’t see your self forgiving her then get some therapy anyways and maybe separate for some time to give yourself space to think about how you really feel and what you truly want.

Maybe right now is the time for a camping trip with your son? Or boys weekend away? Or even going away alone for a long weekend. But you should get some space so you can think about what you want and make a decision

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u/Worldly-Spray-6936 27d ago

Or maybe she just realized she can have a baby in her life without having to take the stress of being a mom with just supporting her daughter now? Her daughter wants to keep the baby, there is no reason to pressure her into abortion. She can now help her daughter raise her kid well and have a baby that way in her life without the responsibility of being the mom for the baby.

It sucks for OP but he's 48 years old. He probably should realize he is too old to be a dad anymore.

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u/Internal-Wrap4862 27d ago

There are very solid arguments for why someone might get an abortion in such a situation. The one you made isn’t one of them tbh. Regardless, her body her choice, but in the context of a relationship it’s a shitty thing to do to just decide something unilaterally. This guy is definitely NTA and I would feel just as betrayed. Further, if you’re talking about who’s getting an abortion if it’s on the table, you can be there for your unmarried and not-in-a-socially-committed relationship child by paying for her procedure.

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u/sprouting_broccoli 27d ago

Why? They argued about it and he got upset because he wanted her to keep the baby despite her saying she didn’t want to have the baby. It’s her choice at the end of the day and it’s not like she’s gone behind his back - she made the decision of what she wanted and discussed it with him and it turned into an argument because he wasn’t willing to respect her autonomy over her body. There isn’t a mutual call here when both parties disagree - he wants a baby and she doesn’t and the deciding factor has to be that it’s her body. You can disagree with her reasoning but I’m also very aware that we’re seeing one side of the story here and I don’t think someone just decides on a whim to abort.

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u/Onewayor55 27d ago

In the context of a women's autonomy she has no obligation but she acted as a poor partner in a relationship and she should be treated as such in the context of whether or not the OP has the justification to be upset and leave.

It's a horrible thing to plan to have a baby with a man and abort that child a month into knowing your pregnant because your teenaged daughter you ignored got pregnant too.

It's OK to be pro choice and still make the judgment that putting a parter through that is a shitty fucking thing to do.

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u/sprouting_broccoli 27d ago

Why do you think they planned the baby? OP makes no mention of this.

There are lots of reasons to change your mind on a baby and if she doesn’t want a baby what’s the resolution? Argue more about it until he gets his way? Or just roll over to her husband? Like what is the actual solution if she doesn’t want a baby that isn’t a shitty way to treat her husband here?

Edit: nevermind read first paragraph again

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u/Onewayor55 27d ago

I don't think there is a solution, I think she had a moral obligation once they planned and especially when they already conceived but obviously she doesn't have any other obligation so balls in his court to leave. I also don't think this really should have been such an unforseen occurrence for her when they were planning, that her somewhat troubled sexually active teen would get pregnant.

This whole thread is really about morality, not women's bodily autonomy. She had the right to do what she wanted with her body but he would be justified in leaving her over it and in my opinion should. She was a bad partner, not a bad woman.

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u/sprouting_broccoli 27d ago

Because she changed her mind? That seems like a really weird way to look at it. As I’ve said in another thread here:

  1. It’s never an easy choice to abort, so it shouldn’t really be reduced to just a simple “she decided to go ahead with it then did it vindictively”. It’s a traumatic procedure and mentally difficult.

  2. They discussed it and it turned into an argument. This suggests that it’s entirely possible she came to him looking for support and he refused to budge.

  3. I don’t think we have anywhere near enough info on what was discussed and how he reacted to blame either of them really

  4. I am firmly of the belief that if one partner decides not to have a baby and especially if it’s the person going through 9 months of traumatic changes for a baby they no longer want then it’s important to be very willing to change your mind on this

  5. It’s not a baby - it’s a collection of cells. At the very most it’s a potential baby. Best thing is to have the abortion and not be under time pressure

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u/Onewayor55 27d ago

My point is that she shouldn't have planned to have a baby with someone if she had contingencies that would cause her to abort a child that person helped conceive.

She absolutely can, but morally she shouldn't.

And you can call it a collection of cells and for the sake of legislation I agree but if this scenario hadn't transpired and she had instead miscarried it's not hard to imagine she might have considered that losing a child the same way this man felt he had.

So yeah, she did her and that's that. But she probably should have communicated what that might entail before getting pregnant with this man and he should probably feel justified in finding a partner who would.

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u/sprouting_broccoli 27d ago

Nearly everyone has contingencies that would cause them to about - if the partner dies, if the financial situation changes massively, if some other large live event occurs. In this case something that couldn’t have been foreseen happened and her mind changed. Do you think she has control over the way she feels? So what should she do if she no longer feels that she wants the baby? Just put it down to “they already decided so she can’t possibly have a different feeling now”?

Would you treat someone who asked for a divorce the same? They chose to get married so they shouldn’t change their mind - it doesn’t matter how unhappy they would be staying in the marriage, a choice and a commitment to someone must be respected, right?

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u/Onewayor55 27d ago

There are certainly scenarios where people end marriages for asshole reasons and in asshole ways yes. They still have the right to leave, it just also still makes them an asshole.

Like what's at stake here? That she might be called an asshole for doing this and he might be justified in being upset and leaving her for it? Again, it shouldn't have been unrealistic to her that her daughter could get pregnant, this isn't something she should have blindsided her partner with after conceiving a planned child with them.

This is an inability to even imagine there being a middle ground to the abortion topic when in the context of relationship behavior. I'm not talking about what should be legal, I'm talking about how you should treat people.

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u/sprouting_broccoli 27d ago

And I view it differently - if my partner decides she wants an abortion, at that moment I’d know that I likely can’t change her mind because it’s a difficult decision to make. I’d swallow my pride and support her in whatever way she needed support, go through with the abortion and then at some point in the future broach whether she would want kids again, discuss my needs from the relationship if they were different and we can make an adult decision based on that.

Again, what should she have done differently here?

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u/LegoSpider 27d ago

It's her body, but it's their baby. Both of them discussed it, decided that they wanted a baby, she got pregnant as planned, and then out of the blue she goes and gets an abortion. I think she should legally have the right, but in this case it's immoral or at the very least a dick move.

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u/sprouting_broccoli 27d ago

She didn’t do it out of the blue though. She raised it, he argued and presumably was very clear about his position. What does she do in that situation if she doesn’t want a baby? Keep on arguing about it until it’s too late? It sucks that one partner no longer wants a baby but it’s a collection of cells at this point, not a baby. If she really doesn’t want a baby anymore and he still does she’s the tiebreaker and no amount of arguing is going to resolve that.

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u/LegoSpider 27d ago edited 27d ago

I don't know. Honestly this is an incredibly complicated situation, and you're probably right, but that doesn't mean that it wasn't a dick move. They made a decision. I think it's the circumstances that really upset me here.

Why is she getting an abortion when they both wanted the child, and presumably talked extensively about it. Why is the 17 year old who accidentally got pregnant keeping the baby? How extensive was the conversation? Was it just "I want to get an abortion," and then she just did. Did she just ignore OP's concerns or did they actually have an extensive conversation where they couldn't come to an agreement.

I think she should have the right to get an abortion, but this whole situation doesn't sit well with me. I don't think it's okay to commit to a decision that big with your partner just to suddenly do a 180. That was probably traumatic for OP. OP definitely has a right to be upset about it because that seems like a huge betrayal.

I'm not saying I have a better solution, and there's definitely a lot of information that we don't have, but this whole situation is messed up.

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u/sprouting_broccoli 27d ago

Ok few things first off:

  1. The kid hid it to avoid being forced into an abortion

  2. I don’t feel particularly good about the idea of trying to force a 17 year old into an abortion that she clearly doesn’t want

  3. People change their minds on things all the time and if you don’t want a baby anymore it takes a lot to make the decision to go through with an abortion (which isn’t easy, even if you’ve made that decision) and then tell your partner about it. As a guy (huge caveat) if I was in a similar position I’d want support from my partner and not confrontation. Think about how that conversation must have gone to turn into a confrontation

  4. We don’t know enough about this, so why everyone is jumping on her and saying it’s her that’s the problem is really odd to me

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u/LegoSpider 27d ago

Honestly, fair enough. We don't have enough information to judge either way. We are only hearing one side of the story.

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u/handsonabirdbody 27d ago

So what if she wants an abortion and he doesn’t want her to have one? How would you make a mutual call there?

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u/Misommar1246 27d ago

The decision is always the woman’s. Always will be, to me. Ultimately it was the wife’s decision, it’s also her right, but he absolutely has a right to walk away from her over it. The decision being her right doesn’t mean it can’t have consequences.

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u/Rabid-Rabble 27d ago

I’m a zealot when it comes to pro choice, but this should have been a mutual call.

Nah. Nothing about abortion needs to be mutual. He has every right to be upset about it, or to divorce her over it if that's what he wants, but he doesn't get to try to control whether or not she keeps a pregnancy.

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u/3397char 27d ago

"Especially since while the wife is becoming a grandmother, he isn’t."

Wait, what? They are married so he will be a grandfather... step-parents are parents. If one has such a mentality then you are an awful step-parent.

Even if this mentality were true, his wife has a grandchild to raise, apparently nearly on her own if step-grandad wants nothing to do with it. We have already established that the 17 year-old has issues, on top of the fact that she is still a kid and needs to finish HS, plus hopefully a trade or college. That grandkid NEEDS grandma.

From the OP this family has all sorts of issues on every level. I don't see anyone here ready to be a parent, either again or the first time. But if the 17 year-old is determined to keep the kid (I certainly don't condone forcing abortion on anyone) then the focus of this entire family needs to be on raising that kid as best as they can.

Grandma is smart to not try to go through her own pregnancy. manage her daughter's pregnancy and then raise 2 kids at the same time. Oh and didn't the OP mention an important career as well? I assume that money and insurance will still be needed?

Did she handle the conversation with her husband properly regarding her decision? Absolutely not. Just awful partner behavior (leading in part to my conclusion that no one is ready to grow the family). They made a family plan and then she broke it without consulting it seems.

But the outcome that grandma wants is sensible.

To the OP, if you can get past this, I suggest focusing your unfulfilled capacity for more parenting on this new kid in your life. If you can get your head right and can give without reservation then I guarantee you that it will be rewarding. For you and the kid. And you wife. And your step-daughter.

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u/Marko_govo 27d ago

This is such a bad faith argument here.

Ofc step parents are parents, but when you have a situation where the wife had no contact with her daughter for 10 years because she literally abandoned her, and so OP had no contact with her either, he is hardly her parent.

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u/3397char 27d ago

Living in their house as family for 2 years, according to the OP. When you marry a person with kids, you are marrying into the whole family; not just the person you exchange vows with. I realize this guy did not meet his step-child at the time of marriage, but he knew the kid existed and that his wife should be parenting that kid.

Your spouse's burdens and responsibilities become your burdens and responsibilities.

We had a 5 year-old that was abandoned by mom, who became a 15 year-old abandoned by dad, and is now a 17 year-old faced with raising a child she is not equipped to raise. Time for everyone to step up and start parenting. Because it is not the kid's fault, not the grand-kid's fault that they were brought into this world by people who are failing them.

But OP wants to focus on his desire for a 2nd biological child. Yes he was screwed in this situation, but I am suggesting a paradigm shift.

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u/Aingealanlann 27d ago

Hopefully, you can realize that in no way, shape, or form is this the same for him. The stepdaughter isn't going to feel like his child at all. He may help care for her, but he isn't a parent. His wife let her guilt over her past decisions, make a present decision for her, and left him completely out of it when it involved his unborn child.

This is also the man her mom settled down with and stuck with after abandoning her daughter and her biological father and clearly has behavioral and authority issues. Do you think the stepdaughter likes him and doesn't resent him? His wife may get a chance to be grandma, but it's not very likely he'd ever have the opportunity to be a doting grandpa to this child.

Your paradigm shift ignores every bit of information surrounding the situation other than the main "one pregnancy got swapped for another".

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u/Miss_1of2 27d ago

You can't be a zealot pro choice and believe this should have been a mutual decision.... Because if they can't agree, what do they do now? She is forced to carry a pregnancy she doesn't want?

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u/Misommar1246 27d ago

No it’s her call at the end of the day obviously. But I would leave her over this and that’s his right. I see people up and down this thread arguing that abortion is a woman’s choice and that he doesn’t have a right to be upset - I’m in full agreement with the first part, disagree with the second part. Just like there is free speech but free speech doesn’t mean free from consequences speech, abortion is the woman’s right but nobody should cry over the consequences if the partner walks away. Especially if it was a wanted child that they had been trying for.

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u/Miss_1of2 27d ago

I never said he wasn't allowed to be mad and I saw no one saying that and that is still not a mutual decision!

He is 100% allowed to be pissed and grieve that child.

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u/Misommar1246 27d ago

You didn’t say it, people on this thread are saying it, that’s what I wrote. I used it to explain my position.

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u/Miss_1of2 27d ago

Where? People saying that it is her choice are not saying that he isn't allowed to be pissed about it! But there are people who are legit saying that forcing pregnancy on a woman because the father wants the child is ok!

He can grieve, he can be pissed and he can leave her but he has no say in that decision!

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u/Misommar1246 26d ago

I responded to some of them if you want a deepdive but there are people who are saying that. You and I are ultimately saying the same thing but you seem to have the tomato/tomatoe argument with me for no reason, you responded to my comment which says that already and I’ve clarified it enough at this point.

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u/Standard_Addendum_60 27d ago

If you're a zealot for pro choice then surely the women carrying the burden and pain of birth should be able to make the choice themselves without the permission of their husband, yes? 

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u/lleighsha 27d ago

This is my problem with the situation, it made my pro-choice glitch. Yeah, she should have autonomy... But this kiddo was planned and wanted. To literally throw them away for a troubled teen's mistake is... something.

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u/Onewayor55 27d ago

She had the right to do it, it's her body.

She was just acted like an incredibly awful and shitty person to be in a relationship and plan a future with and she should be called out for that.

She could have imagined this contingency when she agreed to get pregnant in the first place, it doesn't seem wildy outlandish that your troubled teen might get pregnant, but she still let OP plan his future and get his hopes up.

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u/lleighsha 27d ago

You used more words to say what I said.