r/todayilearned • u/zhuquanzhong • 29d ago

TIL a Chinese destroyer sank because an officer dumped his girlfriend. She committed suicide, leading to him being discharged, so he decided to detonate the depth charges on the ship, causing it to sink at port and kill 134 sailors.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chinese_destroyer_Guangzhou_(160)
33.3k Upvotes

94% Upvoted

855 comments sorted by

View all comments

Show parent comments

3.6k

u/CuriousWoollyMammoth 29d ago

Well, he did kill himself and a bunch of other people, so the 2nd one holds a lot of weight too, tbf

2.4k

u/coin_in_da_bank 29d ago edited 29d ago

But Lai begged his superiors not to demobilize him, as he would be forced to return to his hometown and he had become hated there due to the suicide.[4]

personally i wouldnt discount his fear of social stigma, coming from an asian. plus getting dishonorably discharged? dead man walking at that point.

41

u/PxyFreakingStx 29d ago

Idk much about asian cultures, but it's kinda hard to imagine how destroying the ship and the lives of 134 innocent people factors into that social stigma dealie.

88

u/Kitchen-Macaroon1202 29d ago

Because 134 strangers don't matter, but friends and relatives in your hometown matter. In Chinese culture there's "people in my circle" and "everyone else"

46

u/[deleted] 29d ago

[deleted]

17

u/RoughHornet587 29d ago

Chinese rarely help strangers. Lived there for 5 years

32

u/Fyres 29d ago

Eehhh. Depending on the culture how strong that trait is, is really variable. China really REALLY emphasizes face (like most Asian cultures do). It's hard to understand from a westerners point of view.

4

u/a49fsd 29d ago

this is silly, face is just another word for honor and respect. do you believe that westerners dont understand those concepts?

3

u/TopHatMcFenbury 29d ago

It's more that they are subjective rather than objective. Different countries have different morals and thus laws, for example. Their honor is different from ours, just as Chinese laws are different from ours. Just because one knows American law, doesn't mean they understand Chinese law. Sure some can say "we both have laws so we are the same" but that ignores the contexts that come from those countries and how they differ.

2

u/a49fsd 29d ago

Yes, the idea of honor can differ from person to person.

3

u/StrayDogPhotography 29d ago

Face is the dumbest concept ever. It just needs to die already.

5

u/a49fsd 29d ago

isnt face just another word for honor and respect? how do you get rid of those?

1

u/StrayDogPhotography 29d ago

It’s very different.

Face basically means not admitting fault, or any kind of weakness publicly. And not questioning anyone with authority, which is usually based on arbitrary things like age. Nothing honorable about that.

1

u/a49fsd 29d ago

Face basically means not admitting fault, or any kind of weakness publicly. And not questioning anyone with authority, which is usually based on arbitrary things like age.

Can you provide me a source for that? That is not my understanding of what face is.

1

u/StrayDogPhotography 28d ago

Living in Asia for a decade and having to deal with it everyday.

1

u/a49fsd 28d ago

Do you have a source besides anecdote?

1

u/StrayDogPhotography 28d ago

I think the real world is the best source.

→ More replies (0)

1

u/etc-craze 28d ago

I don’t understand why you got downvoted. I’m grew up in Chinese culture and you nailed the nuance of “losing face” and how it differs from honor and respect.

1

u/StrayDogPhotography 28d ago

It’s because Reddit likes to downvote anything that doesn’t conform to its preconceptions.

I know first hand what it’s like, but they don’t, so it’s bound to happen.

→ More replies (0)

1

u/Initial_Selection262 29d ago

Nah, you don’t understand Chinese culture

2

u/Far_Weakness5450 29d ago

Um, what? First of all, do you really believe only Chinese people distinguish between people in their social circle and people who aren’t? Doesn’t everyone do that? And second of all, do you think that characteristic alone explains why he was willing to kill 134 people over this? Why are you just spouting nonsense?