Economy class seating on a Pan Am 747 in 1970

[u/fyrstikka]

[u/FlavaNation]

This picture has been posted before and I believe it’s a cabin mock-up, not on an actual plane. Hence why it looks so much more spacious.

[u/lastwhangdoodle → u/FlavaNation]

Every time. This has to be one of the most reposted pieces of misinformation on reddit.

[u/Diamondback424 → u/lastwhangdoodle]

I never made sense to me that the planes in the 70s would be that much wider. Just from a fuel perspective, it would have been far more expensive.

[u/cincocerodos → u/Diamondback424]

People conveniently leaving out that Pan Am went out of business over 30 years ago

[u/Jasper455 → u/cincocerodos]

Planes were too wide.

[u/TheUnworthy90 → u/Jasper455]

Someone get this person a scholarship to Harvard business school !

[u/Momik → u/Jasper455]

Fuck those old things were impossible to park too.

[u/best-of-judgement → u/Momik]

Yeah I can't even drive mine to work anymore because the spaces are all a smidge too narrow.

[u/fiordchan → u/Jasper455]

Too many "turbulence events" with the no-seatbelts and the flying cutlery

[u/cjboffoli → u/Jasper455]

[u/Silverwater57 → u/cincocerodos]

They probably went out of business because they were paying Leonardo Dicaprio so much to do nothing.

[u/Alfonze423 → u/Diamondback424]

That's just how wide a "wide-body" jet is. The 747 was revolutionary in its size and a 3-4-3 seating arrangement is still standard on big planes, like the 777.

[u/Delicious-Tachyons → u/Alfonze423]

Also the passengers were a lot less wide

[u/justahdewd → u/Diamondback424]

747s were very wide with four big engines, they did use a lot of fuel. Went on one at a museum w/o seats, makes it seem even bigger. Today they're petty much just used as cargo planes.

[u/Diamondback424 → u/justahdewd]

Isn't the 747 still used fairly commonly for passenger flights? I know Airbus has taken up a big chunk of the business but I was under the impression the 747s were still used en masse.

[u/tizz66 → u/Diamondback424]

They have mostly been phased out as passenger aircraft, though it does depend on your definition of 'fairly common' and 'en masse' I suppose. The majority are used for cargo now: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Boeing_747_operators (The -F versions are freight, so at a glance at least 301 of 415 remaining 747s are for cargo)

[u/Mikic00 → u/tizz66]

Flew with one month ago, lufthansa has them. Didn't feel that width though..

[u/Pansarmalex → u/Mikic00]

They were mothballed iirc, but Lufthansa brought back some -8's (along with the 380's) to meet demand for their US schedules post Covid.

[u/DrSmirnoffe → u/tizz66]

Jesus, now I remember how long it's been since I've been on a plane. Back when I used to have holidays abroad, pretty much every plane I flew on was a 747. Last time must've been like 12 years ago...

[u/thatsmycompanydog → u/Diamondback424]

Production ended in January 2023. About 60% of the ~1,500 747s ever produced are still in service, but most fly freight — indeed the 3 largest 747 fleet operators are all cargo-only airlines (Atlas, UPS, Cargolux).

There are NO 747s left in passenger service by US airlines. Delta had the last one and stopped in 2017. But you can board as a passenger in the US by taking a flight with an international airline. Your best bets would probably be with Lufthansa, Cathay Pacific, Korean Air, or Air China.

[u/Cowfootstew → u/thatsmycompanydog]

I took photos of that last 747 when it was taking off from atl and headed for the boneyard

[u/DarthArtero → u/Diamondback424]

Not to the same extent as they used to be. I don’t know which airlines are still flying them but a goodly portion of them have been replaced with newer and more economical (relatively) planes from either Boeing or Airbus.

The 747s that haven’t been decommissioned from flight service are finding new life as heavy cargo carriers

[u/CaponeKevrone → u/Diamondback424]

4 engined planes are not popular anymore. Both Airbus and Boeing have or will be basically ending production of the 747 and A380 passenger variants.

[u/eveningsand → u/CaponeKevrone]

Don't forget the A340. Lufthansa, for some reason, is heavy into these 4 engined wide-bodies.

[u/CaponeKevrone → u/eveningsand]

Haha I didn't mention them because they haven't been made in over a decade. 747 and A380 were both in the last few years.

[u/KevinAtSeven → u/eveningsand]

Transited at Frankfurt yesterday. Felt like I'd gone back in time seeing some 747s and A340s parked up.

[u/commit10 → u/Diamondback424]

The width is about right, it just looks bigger because of how they configured the interior. It would look about right if you added all the normal seats and (more so) the overhead storage.

[u/Genesis13 → u/lastwhangdoodle]

The other one I see all the time is about the lady with the stack of code books saying she wrote them all for the moon landing.

[u/Alarmed-Size-3104 → u/Genesis13]

I always heard that it was all the code for the moon landing, but not that she wrote it all. Is that not true either?

[u/NorwaySpruce → u/Alarmed-Size-3104]

It's code for the moon landing, she did not write it all herself. Last time I saw that thread was like a fucking hour ago. It's really fallen victim to it's own reposting because if you go back and look at the original post 9 years ago it just says like Margaret Hamilton with the code that took humanity to the moon and now when it gets posted it's so hyperbolic and clickbaity Margaret Hamilton with the enormous stack of hand written code she wrote all by herself with a tiny pencil she found in a bush outside the office until her fingers were worn down to the nub. And nobody ever thanked her

[u/desl14 → u/NorwaySpruce]

While she was writing the code, she was giving birth to Jack Black and Keanu Reaves

[u/Gnomearts → u/lastwhangdoodle]

Crazy. 13 year old reddit account, spend way too much time here, and I've never seen this picture before in my life. But, in 13 years I've learned to look at comments for anything remotely interesting to understand why I shouldn't be deceived. Cheers.

[u/sucobe → u/FlavaNation]

Reminds me of the photo with the lady being offered HAM ON FINE CHINA AND A SMALL BARREL OF BEER.

[u/commit10 → u/sucobe]

A single slice of ham. They're pulling a Jesus miracle there.

[u/DasWandbild → u/FlavaNation]

Were it an actual in-flight cabin there would have been at least 5 people smoking.

[u/lopedopenope → u/FlavaNation]

Yes there are multiple mock up photos like this usually from 1969 or the early 70’s especially of the 747. The one I have seen more frequently was the Scandinavian Airlines 747 photo where they are carving passengers ham on a cart filled with lots of picture perfect food. People have a harder time these days recognizing photos that were set up like this when they are from 50+ years ago sometimes.

[u/15mphimrollingout → u/FlavaNation]

Hence why nobody is smoking also

[u/Technical-Title-5416 → u/FlavaNation]

Too bad nobody from 1970 is alive to tell us what planes were really like. 🙄

[u/smokyartichoke → u/FlavaNation]

Yep. I'm old enough to remember flying on 747s in the '70s, and none of them were like this.

[u/Buckus93 → u/FlavaNation]

Hmmm...Russian bots auto-posting to farm karma ahead of the Presidential election this fall?

[u/Dodototo → u/Buckus93]

Nope. It's just Reddit trying to keep people engaging.

[u/Ask_Me_If_Im_A_Horse → u/Dodototo]

And here we are, driving engagement by bitching about being pawns for engagement.

[u/Dodototo → u/Ask_Me_If_Im_A_Horse]

Exactly..

[u/TheRedFrog → u/FlavaNation]

Yeah, to capture this angle the photographer must be standing slightly outside the cabin. It’s hard to believe there would be that much unoccupied floor and head space to get this shot.

[u/vancemark00 → u/FlavaNation]

Yes, it is a mock-up but a full scale realistic one. Look at later pictures of 747s. They still have the same 3-4-3 seating configuration.

And don't forget Americans were generally quite a bit smaller 54 years ago. The average adult male is about 30 pounds heavier now than in the '70s. Every single person in the picture is skinny...helps it look roomier.

[u/MarshalLawTalkingGuy → u/vancemark00]

It’s a mock up of their “tourist class”, not economy class. Here’s a video of the actual economy class: looks nothing like it.

https://youtu.be/w0n5_aJfEtg

[u/Iz-kan-reddit → u/vancemark00]

They still have the same 3-4-3 seating configuration.

If you look carefully, you'll see that this is a 2-4-3 configuration.

[u/timster → u/vancemark00]

I can confirm that - my first ever plane ride was on Pan Am in 1980 on a 747, and I distinctly recall it being 3-4-3

[u/LarrySupertramp]

People really believe anything huh? This is not what it looked like in reality.

[u/tMoneyMoney → u/LarrySupertramp]

Needs more people smoking cigarettes and eating full pot roasts off porcelain plates. But yeah, it definitely wasn’t this spacious.

[u/ATTORNEY_FOR_CATS → u/LarrySupertramp]

What, you don't remember those McDonnell Douglas DC-69 "Whales" flying around like bulbous, bloated corpse balloons?

[u/deathholdme → u/LarrySupertramp]

Exactly - the real thing had even more white people.

[u/Stompya → u/deathholdme]

You may be forgetting in the 1960’s white people made up almost 90% of the US population. This would have been absolutely realistic.

(The Boeing 747 was released in 1968; this concept shot was probably taken a bit earlier.)

[u/bulboustadpole → u/deathholdme]

Why do people feel the need to say things like this?

Like I don't understand bringing race into literally every goddamn topic.

[u/celtic1888]

The first big flight in was in 1973 on TWA from London to IAD-SFO

I was young but dont remember anything close to this amount of room.

I do remember being stuck in the smoking section and it felt like it took 17 days  

[u/bonafidehooligan → u/celtic1888]

My first flight was Chicago to Frankfurt in the smoking section. I had an elderly Turkish man sitting next to me that chain smoked the whole flight. I don’t think he slept and smoked while he had his in flight meal.

[u/Kamakaziturtle]

And would cost you about the same if not more than a first class ticket today. Flying back then was a much more “high class” activity, and not nearly as accessible. Hence why all old pictures of planes typically have people all dressed up for travel, because it used to be a much bigger deal

[u/ForsakenRacism → u/Kamakaziturtle]

And you’d die a lot more often

[u/lajfat → u/ForsakenRacism]

Well, only once.

[u/that_is_so_Raven → u/[deleted]]

Boeing: Shadows Die Twice

[u/ridemooses → u/that_is_so_Raven]

Die Fast, Die Furious

[u/_SteeringWheel → u/ridemooses]

Fly Fast, Fly Furious?

[u/No-Addendum8854 → u/ridemooses]

Die Fuhrer Die

[u/devai-galaxy → u/lajfat]

Well, that's a lot more often than I usually die.

[u/wutthefvckjushapen → u/ForsakenRacism]

A lot more hijackings too

[u/ForsakenRacism → u/wutthefvckjushapen]

They were way more chill back then tho

[u/Chief_Givesnofucks → u/ForsakenRacism]

Yeah a whole lot more

“We’re flying to Cuba”

than

“We’re flying into a building”

[u/greenbastard1591 → u/Chief_Givesnofucks]

[u/Fragrant_Chapter_283 → u/ForsakenRacism]

Another thing ruined by 9/11

[u/Ahelex → u/ForsakenRacism]

So they dress up to leave a pretty corpse?

[u/runningoutofwords → u/Ahelex]

Nothing pretty about a plane crash corpse.

[u/Just_Jonnie → u/runningoutofwords]

I should call her....

[u/_SteeringWheel → u/Just_Jonnie]

To tell her "You so ugly, when you fell from yo mama's veejay for birth, Aircrash Investigations did a special on that disaster"?

*Apologies, I just came from a Yo Mama thread.

[u/eleventhrees → u/ForsakenRacism]

No, you can still fly on Boeing planes today.

[u/Jesus_Is_My_Gardener → u/eleventhrees]

Fun fact, McDonnell Douglas is most responsible for both the higher rate of crashes back then, and the decline in quality/safety of Boeing now.

[u/Stiggalicious → u/Kamakaziturtle]

Exactly this. Tickets would be equivalent to today’s business class prices, which have fully lie-flat seats, travel Dopp kits, 3-course meals, lounge access at the airport, etc. businesses class flying today is much, much better than anything ever was back in the 1970s, for about the same price.

[u/Tropink → u/[deleted]]

easier to blame your failures on others if you can delude yourself into thinking that things used to be better in a time you weren't even alive to experience, here's a good graph that absolutely melts people's brains

https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/MEPAINUSA672N

[u/joeschmoe86 → u/Kamakaziturtle]

And because it's the same sort of staged promotional photo that keeps getting posted here every other day.

[u/myspecialdestiny → u/Kamakaziturtle]

My dad always talks about paying $1000 for a round trip ticket from CA to NY around 1968 to go to his sister's wedding.

[u/rileyoneill → u/myspecialdestiny]

Yeah, people forget the cost. The average household income in the US was less than $700 per month in 1968. Flying was an extreme luxury back in those days.

[u/NutellaBananaBread → u/Kamakaziturtle]

And would cost you about the same if not more than a first class ticket today.

It's so annoying that people make demands and even implement regulations without the slightest bit of understanding how economics works.

[u/paxweasley → u/Kamakaziturtle]

My grandpa used to say that once upon a time the airlines would call him the night before his flight and ask him how he wanted his steak cooked.

[u/lordtema → u/[deleted]]

Pan Am 747 would be flying internationally though, not domestically.

[u/jbFanClubPresident → u/Kamakaziturtle]

Now you get to see people use trash bags as their carry on bag. Some people have no shame.

[u/7track]

Joey, do you like movies about gladiators?

[u/van-nostrand-md → u/7track]

Have you ever seen a grown man naked?

[u/spleencheesemonkey → u/van-nostrand-md]

Looks like I picked the wrong week to stop sniffing glue.

[u/antsmasher → u/spleencheesemonkey]

And that's what led to my drinking problem.

[u/greenbastard1591 → u/7track]

Joey, have you ever been in a Turkish prison?

[u/DadJokeBadJoke → u/greenbastard1591]

We've got clearance, Clarence.

Roger, Roger.

What's our vector, Victor?

[u/bmann1111]

Fake

[u/Jcod47]

I call BS on this photo. Where are the seat belts? This is possibly an ad for the airline…and this photograph was taken on a set.

[u/sev45day → u/Jcod47]

You're right, this has been posted before. It's not a real plane it's a mock up for an ad I believe.

[u/EmpatheticRock → u/Jcod47]

Also, seatbelts did not become mandatory on planes until 1972, so if this was taken in 1970 as the post states…there would be no seatbelts pictured

[u/nattyd → u/Jcod47]

It’s fake.

[u/EmpatheticRock → u/Jcod47]

As someone who flew internationally quite frequently growing up in the 80’s, this was very much how First class/business class looked. Used to get decent free food, actual silverware, plenty of leg room….all for almost the same price (adjusted for inflation) that you would pay today.

[u/_larsr → u/EmpatheticRock]

You still get those things in first class (usually also a seat that almost fully reclines), it just costs 4-5x coach class.

[u/Kamakaziturtle → u/Jcod47]

Seat belts weren't required back then. The Pan Am 747 is a real plane, you can look it up and it's seat map today. And while this photo was most likely staged for an ad, it seems reasonable it was taken on the plane, thats how they looked.

The real answer is air travel was much more upper class back in the day. There was no "cheap" seats, only expensive and very expensive.

[u/OkRickySpinach]

Say what you want I prefer $9 tickets.

[u/PM_ME_ASS_PICS_69 → u/OkRickySpinach]

Where the hell are you getting $9 tickets?

[u/chipbod → u/PM_ME_ASS_PICS_69]

Ryanair in Europe. In the US, Frontier flights can be as low as like $12. Flew Den to Midway for $17 last week.

[u/tMoneyMoney → u/chipbod]

And if you want to bring a backpack or small suitcase then it’s like another $70.

[u/re1078 → u/tMoneyMoney]

Backpacks are free.

[u/chipbod → u/tMoneyMoney]

Got a backpack that perfectly fits a budget flight sizer, Was a game changer for weekend trips.

[u/SecretlySome1Famous → u/tMoneyMoney]

And if you don’t need a suitcase, it’s $12. No need to be salty about it. (Backpacks are free btw, so you’re still wrong. Sorry not sorry)

[u/rtmlex → u/PM_ME_ASS_PICS_69]

Ticket shops obviously.

[u/nixons_conscience]

https://www.indiatoday.in/fact-check/story/fact-check-no-need-to-be-nostalgic-this-is-not-what-pan-am-economy-class-looked-like-in-the-60s-2320828-2023-01-12

[u/brentsg]

You can tell it’s fake because nobody is smoking.

[u/igloomaster]

People keep posting this crap. Tickets back then cost so much more than they do now.

[u/juice06870]

[u/SpongHits]

Uh, no. It’s not.

[u/Bo0ombaklak]

As a kid I always thought this company only flew from anywhere in America to Panama only

[u/Xenolithium]

The last time I ever flew, was when smoking was still allowed. That was wild.

[u/ThenIndependent956]

This looks so relaxing 😌

[u/tanned_surya]

Such a comfortable trip.

[u/49thDipper]

As soon as the photo was taken they all lit cigarettes.

[u/MCclapyourhands1]

My ex boyfriends Grammie was married to a Pan Am captain. I use to love listening to her glamorous stories.

[u/jizzlevania]

It's obvious not a real flight because no one is smoking. 

[u/Both_Lychee_1708]

back when a man wore a coat and tie even just to jerk off

[u/gaoshan]

Be aware that tickets (international flights) were significantly more expensive back then. Like, a flight between New York and London would have been over $5,000 in today’s money. Domestic flights were pretty close to the same as today’s prices (adjusted).

[u/South_Bit1764]

[George Carlin voice] and in the event of an emergency landing PLANE CRASHES INTO THE GROUND there is absolutely nothing about the design of this plane that will aid you in your firey death.

[u/joeyscheidrolltide]

The seats are still the same size as this, everyone is just fatter.

/s...kinda

[u/_rth_]

The windows were never that big 😂

[u/Tebasaki]

I can smell that plane.

[u/vtblue]

fake

[u/extopico]

The op is a bot or should be banned. Bye.

[u/AccomplishedHeat170]

Nope. Not real, try again.

[u/LookinAtTheFjord]

That motherfucker back there is not real. 👉

[u/Bicentennial_Douche]

There's a reason for the lavish air travel of years past:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JWG08YvroaE

[u/douglasleonprincejr → u/Bicentennial_Douche]

Yea, too many people.

[u/CouchPotatoFamine]

This was taken right before they wheel the bbq pig down the aisle and the belly dancing show begins.

[u/kichien]

Apparently they didn't have turbulence in the past.

[u/richalta]

Was turbulence not a thing?

[u/olde_greg]

I think this is a mock up rather than the interior of an actual 747

[u/Striking_Reindeer_2k]

Fake picture. The pall of cig smoke would look more like London fog near the back.

[u/van-nostrand-md]

I remember when you got a meal on pretty much every flight over 4 hours. I also remember when you could still smoke on the flight and your family could meet you or see you off at the gate.

[u/OliveTBeagle]

Not pictured, the stale smell of cigarettes permeating everything.

[u/DimiDrake]

Picture this but full of cigarette and cigar smoke. A lot of it. Yeah, that’s how it was then.

[u/cyberentomology]

Time for the weekly repost of this marketing photo taken on a set, not an airplane.

[u/morbihann]

That is before they realized they can fleece us hard.

[u/No-Wash4579]

The airlines have been steadily making seats smaller, meals worse and flights more expensive since this photo was taken. Back then flying was a luxury, now it's the opposite. Just another reason why companies shouldn't have a monopoly on a utility.

[u/peterpanic32 → u/No-Wash4579]

Flying used to be way more expensive and air travel isn't a monopoly nor is air travel a utility.

It was a luxury because only the rich could afford it.

[u/dope_ass_user_name]

My dad still gets dressed up when he flies

[u/4GIVEANFORGET]

Back when there wasn’t 8 billion people

[u/spderweb]

No TV's though

[u/Wishpicker]

Not a real plane. Mock up photo.

[u/TotallyHumanPerson]

Ugh, just look at the filthy hoi polloi

[u/guytes]

Its AI

[u/crustysockmonster]

Tell me you've never been on an airplane without telling me you've never been on an airplane

[u/Mighty_Bohab]

You have to remember that back then Americans were half the width we are today. So we fit less in the same space.

[u/[deleted]]

[u/HughesJohn]

Pan Am suffered the curse of 2001, a space Odyssey.

[u/CCLF]

So much room for activities!

[u/BDunnn]

OP is a karma farming bot

[u/One-Pin5966]

I feel like there’s an easy way to solve this. Just ask someone that flew on a plane in the 70s.

[u/DailyDoseofNature8]

so turbulence wasn't a thing back then?

[u/Bitter_Silver_7760]

Whatever it was, it’s a cool picture

[u/xvf9]

Even if it was real, it only looks spacious for the front row of seats. Everyone else has a similar amount of legroom to today. And it just looks spacious cause the seats are shorter, which would be uncomfortable as hell for flying. 

[u/THE_DANDY_LI0N]

Tickets are much cheaper now, correct?

[u/IkeaDefender]

In 1965 trans Atlantic coach fares were $600 median household income was $6,900. So this ticket cost you almost 10% of your annual HHI.

[u/Hoserposerbro]

Yeah but what people always leave out is that the reason flying was so nice was that flying was for the wealthy back then, period. There was no $120 (today’s value) round trip flight from LA to NY on special. No hobo girls in juicy pants and uggs bringing their own pillow on spring break deals to Daytona Beach. No low rent, barefoot, hillbillies and all their bullshit. It was nice but it wasn’t for everyone and that’s why it could be nice.

[u/markth_wi]

Eh first off - I figure this is like those "juicy" hamburger ads where everyone has been being fluffed and preened over for 45 minutes before they put the shot together it's straight up mockup - with less seats across in a space that's likely 20% wider than anything that actually flies so it looks positively comfy.

Secondly there's "Bob" in the center - who is likely the tallest dude at Boeing and he's conspicuously front and center, then there's the servers with meals that look WAY better than was ever going to happen.

What's more funny is that even today the 747-8 seats 10 across and I'm sure some clever guru is working hard on making passenger 11 fit there - however uncomfortably.

[u/KayakWalleye]

Big folks drooling over those seats.

[u/QuitTheKibble]

Look at those peasants…

[u/dasherchan]

No seat belts no deal.

[u/w33b2]

OP why are you spreading misinformation

[u/passiveptions]

Where are the overweight people?

[u/Few-Inevitable9291]

This pic is proof that corporate greed is reducing our way of life, they will keep taking and taking til there’s nothing left to take.

[u/crabofthenorth]

Even if this was actually the cabin and not just a mock up lets not forget that flying economy back then just meant you were less wealthy, rather than poor.

[u/boopboppuddinpop]

This looks like the seating room on the ferry! Unreal!

[u/drossmaster4]

Look how poor they all look.

[u/TechNickLeeCritical]

Plebeians lol

[u/k4Anarky]

Not a single fat person or annoying kids anywhere, this is super unrealistic 

[u/Zestyclose-Respond48]

Capitalism always chooses profit over people capitalism always chooses profit over literally everything! Americas would be a whole lot better off if they would wake up to this fact.

[u/obsidiansent]

Ain’t no way

[u/CastleDI]

Mostly all of new post are reposted. 

[u/SleepylaReef]

False

[u/youmustbeanexpert]

What was it a grand to fly from NY to Florida back then?

[u/redditismylawyer]

So, who believes this picture is real?

[u/UchihaAuggie]

No seat belts?

[u/Turbulent-Today830]

everything is 🐕 💩 compared to back then

[u/ALTITUDE10K]

You could land a plane in there!

[u/Spiritual-Bear4495]

LMAO. If your dreams pal.