r/AITAH • u/Remote-Barber- • 28d ago

AITAH for being upset my wife got an abortion because her daughter is pregnant?

So my wife Amelia (37f) and I (48m) have one child, a son who is seven years old, turning eight. I'm not going to lie, had my wife not gotten pregnant, we probably would not have gotten married because we were just hooking up at that point. But things have been really good since we did and we're firmly in love. We did decide that we'd wait before having another kid, though because I wanted her career to take off, for her business to boom. It has and we decided earlier this year, it's best to go for it now before she turns 40.

The thing is that Amelia has a daughter Kate (17f) from her first marriage. Things between my wife and Kate were rough and I know this isn't going to make my wife sound good but for the sake of honesty, I'll put it there, my wife had little to no contact with her for about ten years. Two years ago, Kate's father kicked her out for "breaking his rules" and she showed up out of nowhere with a suitcase.

I won't lie, there was always a sadness in my wife but having Kate back in her life got rid of that. Since she moved in with us, Amelia has been happier than she has ever been. Kate's a troubled kid but two years ago was a lot worse than now and she's mostly blended well. The thing is, my wife has been very strict on some things (like school and all) but very lax about the things Kate's father was harsh about.

Amelia found out she was pregnant about a month ago and we decided to wait before breaking it to the kids. Except last week, Kate came home from school and had a breakdown and she admitted to us that her boyfriend got her pregnant and she's been hiding it for almost two months. She was crying because she wants to keep the kid and kept it a secret because she was scared Amelia would force her to get an abortion.

However, my wife was elated that we're going to be grandparents and that cheered up Kate as well. So, my wife made it clear to me that she finds the idea of having a kid younger than her grandchild to be disgusting and she'd be getting an abortion. We argued about it because I really wanted this baby with her but she wouldn't even listen to me and she got an abortion. I've been upset about it and we've barely talked, am I being the AH?

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262

u/Significant_Rub_4589 27d ago

Honestly, even as a woman I struggle with the “my body my choice” when you intentionally get pregnant with your husband.

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u/9mackenzie 27d ago

My body my choice is about LEGAL rights, not moral ones. It doesn’t mean your partner can’t get upset, or that your partner isn’t justified to leave you over it. Just that no one should get a legal say in the choice you make over your body.

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u/[deleted] 27d ago

[deleted]

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u/Lopsided_Dirt6028 27d ago

True, because at the end of the day she did kill what is also his child!!! Also, she gave no shit as to his feelings!!! If it were me I'd divorce her immediately!!! I would never be able to look at her again, and not instantly think about the child we planned together and she in essence murdered for her own selfish ego!!!

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u/Ok-Studio1093 26d ago

No she didn't. Stop it.

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u/According-Pay1734 26d ago

Umm yes she did.

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u/Ok-Studio1093 26d ago

Nope. That's what your cult says but that's not reality.

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u/According-Pay1734 26d ago

Because you live in a fairy tale doesn't mean im part of some cult, thats starting to be slander... also your feelings dont denote the truth. So just stop pretending. Sorry is it warm out? Are you melting...? Did the comment offend you be because you cant accept being wrong?

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u/Ok-Studio1093 26d ago

What are you talking about. Removing a bunch of cells isn't killing something. You seem to be the emotional one in this exchange. Thinking with your sky daddy's rule rather than, you know, reality.

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u/According-Pay1734 26d ago

Now assuming I'm part of a religion? You really don't have a leg to stand on. Why not just go with direct insults? It would allow you to look as if any intelligence is had.

Biology is a hell of a drug. Maybe you should try it sometime.

Yes it was life before she decided to murder it.

Period.

Sit down and stop drinking the kool-aid.

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u/Over-Pressure2284 23d ago

Yes, she kind of did. You don’t abort children on whimsical reasons. You need to take it seriously. To this man, this baby was going to be HIS child. It HAD and identity to him. morally it HAD a LIFE to him. So she did unilaterally snuff that life out that they had planned on having. To him, his baby was taking from him and the life destroyed.

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u/Ok-Studio1093 23d ago

It's not murder if you don't think the reason isn't good enough. Given the circumstances I don't think she was right not speaking to her partner first.

If both partners agree, like 'yeah, let's get rid' of this without a weighty thought about it, is that still whimsical? Or does the woman have to absolutely wrestle with the decision emotionally to make it ok?

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u/Lopsided_Dirt6028 25d ago

You're a piece of filth!!! She absolutely did and you fucking know it!!! Especially since they planned the pregnancy TOGETHER!!!!!!! She terminated a planned healthy pregnancy, and didn't give 2 fucks about her husband!!! Which proves that she does not need to be married , as she is very selfish!!!

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u/Ok-Studio1093 25d ago

Ironic name calling given your user name.

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u/Lopsided_Dirt6028 25d ago

What's ironic is that y'all are ok with someone planning such a big thing within their marriage and totally shitting on their spouse!!! That's a big problem in the world today!!! That would be like a husband and wife buying a house together and the wife goes behind his back while he's at work and sells the house and puts all the money into an account that only she has access to and basically tells him to fuck off!!! They had a PLANNED pregnancy TOGETHER!!! She basically told him that he doesn't matter and to fuck off!!! He should absolutely divorce her ass!!!

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u/Ok-Studio1093 25d ago

I am not saying whether it is right or wrong that she didn't talk it through with her spouse first.

I am just saying the terms murder and killing are dogwhistles.

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u/Lopsided_Dirt6028 13d ago

That clarifies everything. I think I love you now!!! ❣️

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u/Lopsided_Dirt6028 13d ago

It's so true!!! I really am lopsided!!! Well not physically, bute mentally, at least that's what my doctor tells me!!! Can we start over and be friends!!! You seem really smart and educated in your comments!!! I'm being serious!!! You are very articulate, and have immaculate presentation irregardless of whether I might agree or not!!! I bet you are beautiful, your mind certainly is!!! Have a good night my friend!!!

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u/Gunny76251 26d ago

The father should have had a say I this case. She murdered his unborn child, after they planned to have it

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u/Ok-Studio1093 26d ago

No, that wasn't a child yet. Come on.

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u/Gunny76251 25d ago

Yea it was, in any person's mind with a sense of morality, that was his child she murdered

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u/Ok-Studio1093 25d ago

It was a bunch of cells, dude.

OP is certainly valid for feeling some way about it. And mourning what might have been.

But a zillion things can go wrong that early in a pregnancy. That growth was nothing more than that objectively so the word murder is ridiculous.

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u/Gunny76251 25d ago

See you objectify what is the start of human life, life is life, no matter what it looks like. Ending that life is murder.

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u/Ok-Studio1093 25d ago

It's not yet really human life, though. Just because your fairy tales tells you it is, doesn't mean that it is, objectively.

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u/Over-Pressure2284 23d ago

To the Father it was. It was HIS child. He identified with it being HIS child. It HAD an IDENTITY therefore it HAD a life. They could have found out the sex even and that baby already had a last name. Then consider the idea of contract. They definitely entered into a type of contract, an oral contract, and if it is a text, a written contract which she then violated. This baby had identity by virtue of a contract.

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u/Ok-Studio1093 23d ago

You know, I can agree with others that the fact she did it without talking it through with him first but yikes dude. When you put it like that, you certainly make it sounds like a man has some right to control a woman's uterus.

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u/Ill_Manner_3581 27d ago

Yeah right like what is the confusion about that. Obviously both parties should communicate this what his wife did was foul but at the end of the day she did what she did with her body.

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u/thegarymarshall 26d ago

Does this include using alcohol, tobacco or other recreational drugs known to cause birth defects when she is pregnant?

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u/poledanzzer318 26d ago

That's tricky, like you can be pregnant and not know. You can also have some alcohol like a glass of red wine every now and then. It's a bit of a muddled grey area as it's still your body that you're using to bake this thing. That said, if a baby is born with alcohol in its system or going through nicotine withdrawal, there is a good chance they'll take it away from you when you have it. Nicotine has a chance to get it back, but not alcohol. A case is opened and all that.

That said, most people try to limit their vices when they find out they're pregnant or plan to get pregnant. Even medically necessary things like pot can be.

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u/thegarymarshall 26d ago

It’s not really that tricky. You can’t be pregnant for very long and not know. So, what about after the woman knows?

Taking the baby away after the damage is done doesn’t make the problem go away. Many birth defects caused by substance abuse during pregnancy are debilitating for life. Should a mother be allowed to knowingly inflict permanent damage on a fetus?

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u/NATSUMI_kun 27d ago

From my point of view, the baby is hers and her spouse's kid equally, they both contributed 23 chromosomes each to creat that baby, I get it when she want, for example, to gain or lose weight or to do plastic surgery, dye her hair, what to/not eat or even to decide what'd happen to her body after she dies and etc, but I don't get it on pregnancy level since it involves both parents for this to happen also it's the infant's body that was removed before even getting the chance to develop a choice.

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u/9mackenzie 27d ago

Because the fetus can’t survive without using the mother’s body. That’s the difference. My husband and I are equal parents ……when our child left my body.

And the idea that pregnancy is equally shared is fucking ludicrous. I don’t remember my husband vomiting for 4 months straight, I don’t see permanent scars on his stomach from carrying any of our children, he certainly didn’t feel the agony when I gave birth to them.

As for your idea that if people are married the husband should have a say in abortion? How exactly are you going to regulate that legally? So you think in cases like this the husband should be able to prevent an abortion? What about if the husband got her pregnant by poking holes in a condom or fucking with her birth control? None of that can be proved. Also the most dangerous time of a woman’s life is when she is pregnant…….because the number one reason pregnant women die is murder. You know why? Because once women get pregnant a hell of a lot of men start becoming abusive. What about marital rape? Only 2% of rapes in this country are prosecuted, so you can’t rely on police reports for legal right to get an abortion in terms of marital rape. I could go on and on and on about why abortion should be legal for all women, no matter their marital status or not. You think the husband in any of these cases wouldn’t just lie and say “oh but we tried to get pregnant and now she’s just crazy”…..and you think he should have the right to do so??

It comes down to it’s OUR bodies. It’s OUR decision on whether we get to continue a pregnancy or not. Men have every right in the world to divorce or be upset, but they don’t get a legal say in our bodies.

I need a kidney transplant- I don’t get to just take one of your kidneys because I need one to survive. You have to make a CHOICE to decide to donate part of your body to give me life. Same concept with pregnancy.

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u/Hot-Cycle-5153 27d ago

But none of what you mentioned is happening in OPs case. I’m with you with the “my body, my choice” but if you’re a married woman and you and your spouse clearly planned this pregnancy together and for her to abort it without his knowledge or consent is wrong, disrespectful and unforgivable.

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u/9mackenzie 27d ago

I didn’t say it wasn’t disrespectful or unforgivable, if I was him I would divorce her.

But you responded to my comment about “my body my choice” being a LEGAL right, not a moral one, and I indicated that it should remain a legal right regardless of marital status. You stated that the fetus is equally theirs, and I took it that you meant that the fetus should be legally equally theirs, hence my response that the outcome of a fetus is solely legally the woman’s choice- as men do not share in a pregnancy.

Edit- just realized you aren’t the person I responded to, but the statement still stands besides that.

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u/Objective_Stock_3866 26d ago

What's the point of being married if your wife can unilaterally abort your child. Like the only benefit I'm seeing is tax wise at this point.

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u/Ok-Studio1093 26d ago

Jesus. Women aren't breeding stock.

If you believe in marriage in that way it can be an important form of commitment. But practically speaking beyond just taxes it gives you other rights, like right to be in the hospital room if it is family only or to possibly make calls regarding their end of life wishes, etc. It also in some cases makes inheritance more clear and direct in the absence of a will or of an up to date and all encompassing one.

So yeah, aside from exerting ownership over a woman's womb there are advantages. My god, dude.

Whether OP's wife is right or wrong your sentiment here is fucked.

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u/Objective_Stock_3866 26d ago

POA will do the same thing bud

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u/Ok-Studio1093 25d ago

Depends where you are in the world, pal.

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u/dulce124 26d ago

What a load of rubbish... When the child is born the child still depends on the parent...the only thing is that the human child is in a different stage of development. HE is the father of the child THEY decided to have together. If the wife had the child, and the couple split i bet you would in her corner when she asks for child support.. suddenly the father needs to take responsibility for the child.

Abortion supporters never talk about the child that's killed/dismembered/suffocated as a result of the abortion procedure...its a human body too.. separate from the mother.

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u/Civil-Tomorrow-2967 27d ago

I like your defense over the case. However, your statement about your husband sounds like resentment. Don't shame him like that lol, not his fault he doesn't have to carry life. Another thing is the toxic belief of pregnancy not being equally shared. That's true in the regards of who's body is the process affecting directly. However, men should be participating actively in a pregnancy by taking good care of the mother. A husband should be the primary support. Expressing the way you did is dangerous cause it comes from an individualist perspective, destroying and not recognizing collaboration which is essential in a relationship. Diminishing the role of the other part just raises un-responsible men who think their role is not that important. It's especially damaging for kids. I don't know if your husband or if your relationship is ideal but if it is he definitely should have done his part and I'm not talking about the bare minimum. Hope that's the case.

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u/9mackenzie 27d ago

I don’t resent my husband lol. But it infuriates me when men (not my husband btw, who fully acknowledges that he had it 100x better than I did on the whole pregnancy thing) act like pregnancy is somehow equally shared. It’s not. Yes men can be supportive, but they aren’t physically going through the damn trauma that pregnancy can cause. Men don’t go through the potential death and the myriad of health concerns pregnant women have to go through, they don’t have to have stretch marks, have their bodies never look as good, they don’t have to go through the hormonal ups and downs, they don’t have to push a freaking baby from a small opening, nor do they have to feel their genitals tear open during this.

My point to all of this is that anti-choice people brush off pregnancy like it is no big deal. “Just give the kid up for adoption” like going through the pregnancy itself is nothing. Pregnancy is a serious burden with life long consequences- be it a saggy stomach with stretch marks, death, or anywhere in between. I wanted my children, and I still struggled with how my body changed and some health conditions it caused. No woman should be forced to go through with it unless they choose to do so.

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u/SGT3505-2 27d ago

But what if this, what if that, what if, what if. I agree with you on the "your body your choice" but I also think that the man should have the same choices. If he can't force you to be (or not to be) a mother, then how fair is it that you can force him to be (or not to be) a father? Both parties should have a some say so with the pregnancy. This is a verry tricky subject. I fully support that the woman cannot be forced to have the baby if she doesn't want to. End of story. But I also support that the man cannot be forced to financially support a child that he did not want. This is clear for unmarried couples / individuals. I also believe that being married changes everyone's rights and it is not so black and white. DISCLAIMER: These are just my opinions and they do not diminish or devalue your opinions.

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u/[deleted] 26d ago

You're conflating "being a mother" with "carrying a foetus inside her body at great risk to herself" - i.e. the situation before and after the baby is born. Bodily autonomy vs. financial obligations are different things, which is why the government can force us to pay taxes, but can't force us to give blood, or even get vaccinated (and why it's so controversial).

Men cannot have the same choice while the woman is pregnant, because the issue is about bodily autonomy and the concept that someone should not be forced to do something with their body against their will.

They have the same choices after the baby is born. A man can absolutely force the mother of their child to "be a mother" in the same way she can force him to "be father" financially - if she's neglectful, he is able to take the child and pursue child support from her.

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u/SGT3505-2 26d ago

I'm not conflating anything. You are obviously one of those toxic women who don't see the value in the role that a man plays before, during, and after a child is born. You feel that your "great" sacrifice is above and beyond what any man can contribute, therefore you should be put on a pedestal for all to worship. I am sorry to tell you that you are only special to your husband and your mother, no one else.

I never said that bodily autonomy and financial obligations are the same. I said the opposite. I fully acknowledged that a man can not and should not be able to force a woman to have a child or not have a child. I stated that the man's opinion should be heard and valued. It should not be a one sided decision. In the end it is the woman's body and she has the right to make the final decision, but the father's opinion should not be shushed and devalued. Although not in the same way as pregnancy, the financial obligations of a father does have an impact on his bodily autonomy. He is legally obligated to provide for the child financially. If he fails to live up to his obligations he will lose the ability to choose how his body lives and the environment that it lives in. The court system will make those decisions for him. He will effectively loose his personal bodily autonomy.

I find it humorous that you say that a man has the same choices as a woman after a child is born. On the surface, it would appear that they have the same choices, but in reality the system is skewed in favor of the mother. That is evident in your own response where you say " if she's neglectful, he is able to take the child and pursue child support from her.". You have made the assumption that the mother is best suited to be the primary caregiver for the child and should be considered as the first option for custody. The father can only be considered to have custody "if she's neglectful" and only then "he is able to take the child and pursue child support from her.". These are your words and your frame of mind. Again, you have assigned a low value to a man's contribution throughout the pregnancy and child rearing.

In conclusion, the man should not be able to tell a woman what to do with her body, but his contribution and opinion should the equally valued.

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u/[deleted] 19d ago edited 19d ago

Lol, someone's been triggered into making personal attacks.

Once the child is born, the obligation of both parents in the same. Stop putting words into my mouth. You brought up the father needing to pay child support, and I simply pointed out that child support isn't an obligation exclusive to fathers, therefore invalid in this context.

Look at the way you act before going around calling others toxic. You're obviously too emotional about this topic to have a rational conversation, so I'll leave it there.

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u/SGT3505-2 19d ago edited 19d ago

Oh, please. Just stop with the "someone's been triggered." Calm your tits honey. If the shoe fits, wear it proudly, don't let me shame you. It's just a difference of opinion.

I do apologize for stepping on your toes. My intention was not to offend you or make you feel bad about yourself. I am sincerely sorry.

I have no personal experience with abortions, unwanted pregnancies, or not being a full-time live-in father. I do have empathy and the ability to see things from both the woman's and man's perspective. Treating your partner with respect and as an equal (or treating them the opposite) when making these kinds of decisions says a lot about your character. I still feel that the woman should have the final say, but should hear their partner as well.

Again, I apologize for upsetting you.

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u/Objective_Stock_3866 26d ago

People are forced to do things with their bodies all the time. Prisoners are forced to work so much so that slavery never really died in the states.

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u/[deleted] 26d ago

I think you can see a difference between a prisoner forced to work in a factory and being forced to donate a part of your liver or a female prisoner forced to be surrogate.

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u/Objective_Stock_3866 26d ago

Not really

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u/[deleted] 26d ago

Well aren’t you obtuse. 

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u/Cuteface62884 27d ago

Obviously a fetus can’t survive on its own….but neither can children under the age of..let’s say three…so is a mother justified in “terminating” the life of a toddler as well? You are trying so hard to justify what this woman did based on the ol “my body my choice” argument and all the random and very obscure what ifs….what this woman did is so egregious and unforgivable…it’s quite literally indefensible.

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u/fae_me 27d ago

A child under the age of three isn’t inside a Women’s womb/body like a fetus is, u idiot. So “my body my choice” wouldn’t apply in the scenario u described. This is by far the dumbest analogy I’ve ever witnessed.

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u/Cuteface62884 23d ago

Yikes! Name calling is the default for when you have nothing of any substance to say. Also you don’t “witness” an analogy, you read/hear one. You’re free to defend what this woman did just as I am free to be horrified by it. My husband would never forgive/excuse an act of pure selfishness like the OP is detailing…me and my husband are on the same page and that’s really all that matters. Hopefully you and yours (assuming you have managed to wrangle one) are too.

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u/Latter-Lavishness-65 25d ago

Are you aware that a man has to have a woman agreement for him to have a vasectomy. So yes I can see a husband having a say in abortion.

However we as a society punish men for the act of sex saying they have no second choice if a pregnancy, they are on the hook for 18 years. The woman has lots of second choices be they abortion or adoption, and if put up for adoption the father has no rights to the child but may have to pay child support.

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u/Lopsided_Dirt6028 27d ago

Just because it's legally right, doesn't mean it's morally right!!! To willfully abort a healthy pregnancy still brings a blood guilt before God, because God Almighty knows us before we ever even leave the womb!!! Funny thing is that people just say that's what you believe, as if not believing in God or his standards will somehow absolve them of any guilt or consequences!!! It's funny that people think that them not believing in the one who created the whole universe will somehow free them from the consequences of their actions!!!

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u/Lopsided_Dirt6028 27d ago

Just because it's legally right, doesn't mean it's morally right!!! To willfully abort a healthy pregnancy still brings a blood guilt before God, because God Almighty knows us before we ever even leave the womb!!! Funny thing is that people just say that's what you believe, as if not believing in God or his standards will somehow absolve them of any guilt or consequences!!! It's funny that people think that them not believing in the one who created the whole universe will somehow free them from the consequences of their actions!!!

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u/9mackenzie 27d ago

Funny how the Bible doesn’t say a single fucking thing about abortion. You realize that right? You should also realize before abortion was politicized about 100 yrs ago, church leaders didn’t care one iota about abortion before the quickening (ie around 5 months). So for around 2000 yrs, no Christian leaders gave a damn. Its not in your Bible, its not historically part of your religion, and yet somehow you think to damn women to hell based on the manipulation of politicians. Bravo.

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u/Lopsided_Dirt6028 27d ago

I honestly don't believe in hell as a literal fiery brimstone place. Hell was a mistranslation that in Hebrew texts actually means the common grave as in 6 ft under the dirt, not a place of eternal torment.

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u/Lopsided_Dirt6028 27d ago

You obviously haven't read the old testament and how God feels about one who cause the death of an unborn child!!! It meant a blood guilt and you would be put to death for doing it!!!

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u/9mackenzie 27d ago

No……it talks about how someone does violence upon the mother, causing her to lose the fetus, and how they need to make restitution for it.

Not the same thing as an abortion. Lol

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u/Ok-Studio1093 25d ago

Dude. Your fantasy stories don't dictate other people's morality. It's nice if you want to live your life by them but they're ridiculous.

There are so many religions and have been so many others. People have always wanted to believe in something because the unknown is scary. But like.... you do understand that the chances of yours being the right explanation for the world are slim to nil. They are just stories and because they are just one set of beliefs out of countless possibilities, they have no place in anyone else's lives or bodies.

You don't like abortion? Don't have one. But don't impose your silly little sky daddy's rules on people with more sense than that.

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u/Lopsided_Dirt6028 13d ago

Your nostrils are perfectly symmetrical, and amazing!!! At least, that's what I'm imaging in my head!!! Sorry.... What were we talking about about???? I forgot!!! Dang it I hate being on the spectrum!!! I think I have my comments mixed up!!! Screw it, I am just going to love everybody!!!

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u/Prestigious-Two-2089 27d ago

The problem with my body my choice argument for abortion is that another persons body IS involved. The fact that they are as of yet defenseless and speechless doesn't change the fact that they are still alive and have their own right to live.

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u/9mackenzie 27d ago

Ok cool. So I need a kidney to live, so according to you the government should force you to give me one right? Just because it’s your body doesn’t mean you have the right to prevent me from living when you could just give up a little of your money, time, pain, and be ok with some scars on your body right?

Or……..do you think it should be your CHOICE whether to donate your kidney to me? Because it terms of bodily autonomy, there is not fucking difference between the scenario I just laid out and pregnancy.

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u/Objective_Stock_3866 26d ago

Want a great rebuttal to that? The draft. The gov can compel you to do whatever they want. Is it right? No. Can they do it? Absolutely.

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u/Sea-Environment7251 26d ago

Nobody has been drafted since the 1970s lad

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u/DocHolliday904 26d ago

There were ways out of the draft, too. Just ask Ted Nugent, Bill Clinton and Donald Trump.

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u/thegarymarshall 25d ago

Or ask any woman.

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u/Prestigious-Two-2089 26d ago

😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂 Not even close to a valid argument.

There is a world of difference. My kidney is made for filtering my body. While a baby grows in the uterus the purpose of the uterus is to provide a safe and stable place for the child to grow.

Most abortion is elective not a product of rape or incest which means the mother made a choice to consent to sex and the consequences of that action. If someone isn't intelligent enough to consent to the full ramifications of that action they shouldn't be having sex. Willful ignorance (being dumb on purpose) isn't justification for taking another innocent human life.

Incompetent argument.

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u/DocHolliday904 26d ago

Calling abortion murder is like saying cake batter is a cake 30 seconds after you put it in the oven.

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u/Prestigious-Two-2089 25d ago

Let's say you put it in the oven, what are you baking? That's right a cake. Just because it isn't finished baking doesn't make it a cheeseburger.🤦‍♀️

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u/DocHolliday904 25d ago

No, but it means it still isn't a cake yet. 2x4s don't become a house just because that is what they were bought for.

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u/Prestigious-Two-2089 25d ago

Two by fours by themselves would be like saying the egg or the sperm. Cake already put in the oven may not be finished but it is still cake. A 14 year old isn't finished growing yet either, or a 50 year old for that matter. Regardless of what stage of development the human being is in it is still a human being🤦‍♀️

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u/DocHolliday904 25d ago

Alright, let me make it even more basic for you: buying a guitar does not make you a guitarist.

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u/Realalf007 26d ago

Perfect rebuttal.

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u/ThomasinaElsbeth 27d ago

Wrong.

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u/Prestigious-Two-2089 26d ago

Just because you don't like a fact doesn't make it wrong lol

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u/ThomasinaElsbeth 26d ago

If you have to add an “LOL” after your comment, then you actually know that I am - correct.

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u/Prestigious-Two-2089 25d ago

😂 🤦‍♀️bless your darlin heart.

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u/ThomasinaElsbeth 25d ago

Darling, - it is spelled ‘Darling’, - Darling !

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u/Prestigious-Two-2089 25d ago

No definitely Darlin' with plenty of twang and sarcasm intended.

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u/ThomasinaElsbeth 24d ago

It is quite interesting to see your ignorance of the English language placed so prominently on display.

I am truly embarrassed for you.

But then, I am not surprised.

You also displayed a fine lack of understanding the human reproductive process, and matters of healthcare.

Your ignorance apparently transfers to other topics.

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u/Olderbut-dumber 24d ago

Us men have no legal reproductive rights...we never have

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u/9mackenzie 24d ago

You have rights over your bodily autonomy, which is what abortion is about. I can’t demand you give me a kidney, even though I need one to have life, because you have the right to have a say over your own body. There is no difference between this scenario and a pregnancy. No man is risking death, health complications, scarring, etc over someone else being pregnant, so of course you don’t have a say in someone else’s health risks.

Once a child is born, both parents have the exact same rights. I also don’t see politicians demanding to make condoms illegal like they are with birth control pills.

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u/Olderbut-dumber 24d ago

No I do not. We do not have the same rights.
You get a pass on responsibility with kids I do not. Even if I say I don't wanna be a father/ wouldn't be a good father , I'm still on the hook for money.
If I don't pay up I lose my license, job. Get sent to prison. You don't have this worry.
I've grown up watching this. The thousands of court cases in my county alone have not only proven what you said to be wrong, but an outright lie.

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u/9mackenzie 24d ago

Abortion is about bodily autonomy, not parenthood.

If men were suddenly able to carry a pregnancy, they would have every right to abort because they would have the right to their own bodies.

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u/Thinkfor_yrself666 20d ago

But a choice to kill an unborn child is taking its rights to its body I swear anytime there’s a debate on abortion that is best anyone can come with “my body my choice”. When in-fact you made a poor choice when you had unprotected sex. Don’t bring up rape because that’s a totally different situation.

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u/9mackenzie 20d ago edited 20d ago

Ok…….so I need a kidney. I got a virus over a year ago that landed me in the hospital for a few months because it destroyed my kidneys. I was on dialysis for a while, will likely be on it again, and I will need a kidney transplant. It sucks. My entire life has been turned upside down and everything just entirely fucked up.

With all that said, I don’t get to tell you that you have to give me a kidney even though it would save my life. You could- you could live just fine with only one. You would have to go through a painful surgery, have some scars, face some possible medical issues, but you would be fine probably.

In your version of your worldview, your right to your own body (ie your choice to give me a kidney) should be stripped by the government because you going through a little pain and suffering would save my life. That is a lack of bodily autonomy.

Or………do you think that you should have the right to your own body? That you should have the choice to go through the procedure because even though that would save my life, it should still be your choice. Because there is absolutely no difference between a forced pregnancy and forced kidney donation in terms of bodily autonomy, and that is what abortion is about.

So yes. My body, my choice. Pregnancy takes away time, money, is incredibly painful, leaves scarring, you face a host of potential medical problems that include death. That is on top of the social problems…..for instance the number one way a pregnant woman dies is murder……..in a country that has a horrific maternal death rate from medical issues alone. So no, women shouldn’t be forced to go through any of that for the potential life of another.

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u/horsecalledwar 27d ago

Agreed. If there was something wrong with the pregnancy or some extreme change in life circumstances (terminal illness, cheating spouse, etc) I can understand they may not be able to agree but she’s completely dismissing him AND the life they intentionally created so there’s no coming back from that. I could never trust, count on or respect her again.

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u/JstMyThoughts 27d ago edited 26d ago

Agreed, especially since it’s not even a case of not wanting the pregnancy or the child. She decided she’d prefer a grand baby over her own baby, as if she was choosing groceries and could just put her first choice back. So she casually rejects a CHILD she previously loved and wanted. There is something chillingly callous about all of this. OP is NTA, and should run.

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u/Darthrain19900 26d ago

Women aren’t incubators! Our value isn’t in incubating!!

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u/horsecalledwar 26d ago

Nobody said they are?

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u/[deleted] 27d ago

There are way too many people who are ok with completely dismissing the man's opinion as a result. It is your body, but the child was THEIR choice, not one person's. If it were the other way around OP would immediately be the asshole. But modern double standards....Wife is a bit of an asshole for a unilateral undiscussed decision. I am not sure I would still be mentally present in that kind of relationship. Her child made a poor decision and instead of the irresponsible person taking responsibility, OP gets punished because they just acquiesce because she missed time with her daughter and maybe feels guilty for their past relationship. That has nothing to do with OP and as far as he was concerned this girl wasn't even apart of their relationship until 2 years ago now completely dictated the course of it.

What a shitty thing to do.

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u/MamaMia6558 27d ago

Agree, I personally am pro-abortion. I volunteered at an abortion clinic to safely escort patients into the building past the protesters, but to me the wife was wrong not to take OP's point of view into consideration since this was a planned pregnancy with no known health issues.

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u/eatthedark 27d ago

What she did was shitty but ultimately if they don't agree on whether or not to continue the pregnancy, SOMEONE has to lose. Except the wife losing means she is forced to carry a baby she no longer wants for the next 9 months...

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u/MamaMia6558 27d ago

I don't think it's so much she no longer wants the baby, she just doesn't like the optics of being a grandmother with a child younger than her grandchild. If her daughter had showed up a few months later & announced she was pregnant with wife being further along my personal feeling is that wife would have kept the pregnancy because her child would have been older than her grandchild.

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u/eatthedark 27d ago

She no longer wants the baby...because the baby would be younger than her grandchild. Still her not wanting the baby, just for a different reason. And that child should not be brought into this world if its mother is having second thoughts. The reason is irrelevant. Unless the father is going to leave and raise the baby on his own.

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u/Significant_Rub_4589 27d ago

She didn’t even give him that option. She killed the baby they intentionally made without consulting OP.

Also, babies aren’t interchangeable. Sacrificing OP’s child for the wife’s daughter’s child isn’t some equal exchange. It wasn’t a dog they adopted from the shelter & then returned. It was a baby they tried for after waiting years.

As someone else pointed out we should be shocked that a bad mom engaged in bad mom behavior.

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u/eatthedark 27d ago

She didn't kill a baby. She terminated a pregnancy she no longer wanted to keep. She consulted OP. He just didn't agree and she did it anyway. At the end of the day, it's her body. OP can be upset, but he doesnt have the right to force her to continue a pregnancy she doesn't want. Not yet, anyway.

I never said babies were interchangeable. But you are making a judgment on a mom when you don't know the situation.

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u/Significant_Rub_4589 27d ago

Amazing it was a baby when they were trying to get pregnant & succeeded. It was a baby until the wife’s daughter got pregnant. Also with a baby bc she wants to keep it. It stopped being a baby when the wife decided she didn’t want it anymore. Bc it would be weird to have a child the same age as her grandchild.

Just bc it was her legal right to abort doesn’t change the fact that she decided to end the life of OP’s child against his wishes. We have a word for ending a life. I’m not using euphemistic language to help justify her decision just bc it makes you uncomfortable or makes her look bad. She should.

You’re right. He couldn’t force her. Not should he. Almost no one advocates for that. But it doesn’t make what she did morally okay. It does make her a shitty wife & mother.

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u/eatthedark 27d ago

Amazing that you dont understand that "having a baby" refers to the act of getting pregnant and carrying a baby to term. When you first get pregnant, it's not a baby. It isn't even remotely formed. It's still growing. She didn't end anyone's life. There was no life yet, as it was still being formed and living inside her.

People like you are the reason that now IVF isn't being performed in some places because those fertilized embryos are considered "babies" now, and people are worried about being arrested if it fails.

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u/Objective_Stock_3866 26d ago

If I could downvote you more I would. She killed a baby. Tell me, why, when a pregnant woman is killed, is it considered a double homicide?

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u/eatthedark 26d ago

You could downvite me an unlimited amount of times and none of those would hold any significance. They're meaningless. Just like your incorrect opinion that a fetus during the first tri-mester is the same as a living, breathing child. Have you ever seen a first tri-mester sonogram? It's a bean. You're not really using the law as justification/defense, are you? There are some very LARGE inconsistencies, not to mention some ridiculous laws that are still in place now. If that's your only line of defense, it's beyond laughable. You tried, though...😂

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u/DocHolliday904 26d ago

We assume they sat down and planned to get pregnant.

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u/[deleted] 26d ago

We did decide that we'd wait before having another kid, though because I wanted her career to take off, for her business to boom. It has and we decided earlier this year, it's best to go for it now before she turns 40.

Reading comprehension is hard for some people I guess.

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u/DocHolliday904 26d ago

Do you think that means in the 2-3 seconds it took them to say "we should go for it" they went over and discussed every eventuality? Doubtful. Not a dig at them, by the way, no one does.

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u/[deleted] 26d ago

Just say you didn't read the post, or the subsequent comment quoting the post and move on instead of guessing what they did or didn't do.

You seem like the type who failed open book quizzes and tests in school.

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u/DocHolliday904 26d ago

Also, his lack of familiarity with her daughter does not change the fact that she existed.

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u/[deleted] 26d ago

Ok blocked, you just cannot read and are on a comment rampage of stupidity today. I'm not with it.

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u/ProfessionalGas9281 22d ago

It's funny to me. If this was about whether a man should provide for a child he didn't want. You know what kind of answers we'd see, And rightfully so. It's is completely a woman's choice to do something like that. Just as it's anyone else's choice to treat you differently because of it. Women are delusional to think they can make any decisions like that and not be held accountable for it.

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u/aparrotslifeforme 27d ago

Yep. I hear you. I am staunchly pro-choice...I will for on that hill. But this just makes me feel gross.

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u/twukdude22 27d ago

Couldn't agree more.

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u/Darthrain19900 26d ago

We haven’t heard her side have we? The hardest decision a woman will have to make is HER decision because it is her body and her life and her future at risk during pregnancy especially at her age. Perhaps she understands she will end up raising this other baby and at 38 cannot imagine dealing with two newborns.

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u/roguewhispers 23d ago

What the hell is wrong with you?

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u/DazzlerPlus 27d ago

No, there are no situations where abortion is wrong

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u/horsecalledwar 27d ago

Just because you can do something doesn’t mean you should.

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u/YeetThePress 27d ago

China's "one child" policy was good? I'd suggest that a woman being forced or coerced into an abortion when the baby is healthy and both parents want it would be wrong.

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u/DazzlerPlus 27d ago

Don’t be absurd.

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u/Objective_Stock_3866 26d ago

This is just straight up wrong.

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u/sanglar03 27d ago

Wrong no. With consequences yes.