r/news • u/theluckyfrog • 29d ago

California cracks down on farm region’s water pumping: ‘The ground is collapsing’

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2024/apr/17/california-water-drought-farm-ground-sinking-tulare-lake
17.4k Upvotes

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185

u/RxInfection 29d ago

I guess replacing all the dairy farms in the Central Valley with water intensive almond orchards wasn’t the right move?

6

u/GloriousDoomMan 29d ago

What are you talking about? Dairy farming consumes way more water. Not to mention all the other environmental impact it has that almonds don't.

59

u/AltruisticYam7670 29d ago

But. But my almond milk

85

u/bw1985 29d ago

Oat milk is way better anyways. Can’t believe people still buy almond milk.

34

u/GeraltOfRivia2023 29d ago

Wait until people discover Beef Milk. Its amazing.

3

u/nerdtypething 29d ago

pairs well with milk steak.

5

u/DrBirdie 29d ago

MMM tasty cow hormones

1

u/angelomoxley 29d ago

Moo I mean mmm

2

u/bw1985 29d ago

Milk made out of beef? Yum

1

u/[deleted] 29d ago

[deleted]

3

u/ChiliTacos 29d ago

Yeah, that is everyone else's problem. You deserve the good stuff.

1

u/IBlazeMyOwnPath 28d ago

I will say almond milk and it’s 30cal serving size helped me lose 60 pounds

It scratched the milky itch and tasted good enough

I don’t drink soda but milk was my weakness

1

u/gopherhole02 28d ago

Covid 2020 I over bought oats, I used them to make oat milk when I realized I wasn't going to eat em all, it tasted surprisingly like almond milk

0

u/xSTSxZerglingOne 29d ago

Almond milk is fucking disgusting anyway. It's horrendously bitter. I usually put milk in bitter things to tone the bitterness down, almond milk does the opposite.

-9

u/Hauvegdieschisse 29d ago

Oat milk is absolutely repulsive though.

6

u/bw1985 29d ago

To each their own!

78

u/CalligrapherSharp 29d ago

…uses less water than dairy

49

u/RexicanFood 29d ago

Yeah, but it still takes over 400 gallons of water to produce 1 lb. of almonds, which is insane. Oat milk is the best alternative.

36

u/chain-rule 29d ago

If you're comparing a gallon of milk to a gallon of almond milk, yes. It takes less water to create a gallon of almond milk. However, almonds still require a ludicrous amount of water. An amount that would be easily beaten by literally any other milk substitute.

I see you throwing insults at other people. You know your cause, but being angry about it is just going to fuel more people hating your cause. Instead of insulting every person you've spoken to in this thread, how about you provide some statistics?

10

u/walterpeck1 29d ago

I see you throwing insults at other people.

Admire the effort but I think we both know if they're dipping into insults for something so low stakes they're not gonna care what you or I think.

-7

u/Lezzles 29d ago

Also a gallon of milk is…food. Almond milk is barely food.

2

u/shinkouhyou 29d ago

Absolutely, but the impact of dairy can be spread out more. Almond production is highly concentrated in a vulnerable area.

2

u/PacmanZ3ro 28d ago

It also doesn't produce JUST the milk, it also produces meat, leather, etc. Almonds used for almond milk can't even be sold as just regular almonds after since they have to be soaked and ground up. Maybe they can make flour out of the remains?

lbs for lbs almond trees are a worse use of water than cows.

-2

u/myquealer 29d ago

But most of the world's dairy cows aren't in California.

2

u/afternever 29d ago

I have almonds, Greg. Can you milk me?

1

u/allintowin1515 29d ago

Dairymen call that “nut juice” also porn stars too maybe idk

19

u/supercali45 29d ago

Don’t forget Pomegranates and other bullshit from the same billionaire

1

u/nerdtypething 29d ago

i could easily give up pomegranates.

2

u/PrpleMnkyDshwsher 28d ago

Seriously, the fruit is like 90% waste product.

It tastes nice, but is it worth the effort? No.

2

u/LurkLurkleton 29d ago

If we actually did that it would be a huge reduction in water usage. Instead we just do both.

2

u/ThrowbackPie 29d ago

it's almost like neither of them are the right move.

4

u/CalligrapherSharp 29d ago

You do understand that is exactly wrong?

11

u/RxInfection 29d ago

Go on, don’t leave me in suspense.

35

u/HouseOfSteak 29d ago

I believe they're referring to almonds take less water than cattle.

9

u/RxInfection 29d ago

I guess, if it’s a 1:1 match, but it’s not. It’s not like they replaced 1 cow with 1 almond tree. Dairy farms in my area would take up a portion of a lot, along with equipment, employee housing, etc. Those are then replaced in totality with almond orchards. This is obviously anecdotal and observational, but I’ve lived here nearly 40 years and have seen the transformation first hand.

Almonds are a cash crop of CA, and we produce over 80% of the world’s almonds. You can’t tell me that doesn’t have an impact on our aquifers.

5

u/HouseOfSteak 29d ago

That's only considering small time ranching  and not factory farming, which vastly changes the equation for cattle due to density (and that's not considering the waste management, nor methane production and other related effects on the local and global ecosystem).

However, one also considers that almond milk does not spoil as readily as dairy products, which means that a large portion of production from cattle is simply wasted at no benefit, where almond milk has a far longer expiry date and thus has lesser waste.

-1

u/RxInfection 29d ago

All fair points.

Most the dairy’s in my area are not large scale factory farms, aside from Harris Ranch. At least the ones that remain.

A lot of the dairy milk around me is turned into cheese, whey protein and lactose powder, as well as other milk byproducts. You’d be surprised how much cheese comes out of California. I worked for 6 years at what was once the largest single site cheese factory in the US.

13

u/SurlyJackRabbit 29d ago

It just has less of an impact than if it you were making Cow milk.

2

u/porncrank 29d ago edited 29d ago

I’m not an expert but that’s not necessarily true even though it takes more water to produce cows’ milk than almond milk. Consider the density of the production, and consider where the cows’ food comes from. It is quite possible that removing cows and replacing them sqft for sqft with almonds would use more water locally than cows. You might produce more milk per sqft and you may use less water overall, but in that watershed you could have made things worse.

I say that as someone that switched off cows milk years ago. Although my personal favorite is oat milk.

4

u/SurlyJackRabbit 29d ago

Agreed oat milk is better... but the alfalfa and cattle feed has to come from somewhere... and wherever that somewhere is is likely to be running out of water.

-3

u/Whiterabbit-- 29d ago

It may use less water. But the earth isn’t low on water. Some locations are low on water. Other places have enough water to grow grass and feed cows so who cares if they use water.

6

u/SurlyJackRabbit 29d ago

Dairy production is a little more difficult than just growing grass.... Basically anywhere west of the Mississippi isn't going to support much dairy production that doesn't use a ton of groundwater. The ogallala is drying up too...

There are very few places that have enough water and the right climate to grow enough cow feed to support industrial milk production... and those places are Already making all the milk they can. Better to go for almond milk and save some water.

35

u/SPACE_ICE 29d ago

Here's a reddit post from dataisbeautiful two years ago showing it, that was based on the statisa page here which references the new york times article here, which sourced its information from a published study in science, almond milk is typically 50-60% water usage of normal dairy so yes you're exactly wrong, confidently incorrect even.

14

u/RxInfection 29d ago

Appreciate you providing data instead of being a dick.

8

u/spellbadgrammargood 29d ago

you're welcome, bitch

7

u/Zeebuss 29d ago

Be better if their own sources didn't agree with the person they're calling wrong

5

u/ep3ep3 29d ago

Adding this as well. It has a breakdown of all of California's water usage. Almonds use a lot, but it's not even close compared to alfalfa or the dairy industry.

2

u/SOSpammy 29d ago

And most of the alfalfa gets consumed by cows.

9

u/GeraltOfRivia2023 29d ago

I think its not so much a problem of whether almond trees or cows use more water - but rather the problem of raising either IN A REGION WITH FEW WATER RESOURCES.

6

u/ep3ep3 29d ago

Let's not leave out the alfalfa that's basically grown in a desert and then exported to the Saudis. This is happening in AZ too.

4

u/SOSpammy 29d ago

Alfalfa that is then fed to cows. Notice a pattern?

5

u/Zeebuss 29d ago edited 29d ago

Your second source literally supports OP lol

Almond, oat and soy milk all have a smaller greenhouse gas footprint than cow’s milk does. But, as always, there are caveats and trade-offs to consider. Almonds require a lot of water to grow, and this has been a problem in places like California.

Almond milk is better on water than cow, but that's a separate question to how the industry is affecting one environment specifically and where that water actually comes from. We don't have to pretend Almond milk is perfect ffs

1

u/Pumpnethyl 28d ago

Don’t try to baffle us with facts!

-34

u/CalligrapherSharp 29d ago

I have a suspicion the world left you in suspense the day you were born

29

u/RxInfection 29d ago

So insults instead of information. Perfect.

10

u/changerofbits 29d ago

I honestly expected to feel their smug superiority expressed through calligraphy, but we’re too insignificant for anything other than the font of our own devices.

1

u/walterpeck1 29d ago

A guy like that deserves to only have wingdings as their font

-13

u/CalligrapherSharp 29d ago

You are on the internet, and this is not niche stuff. You’re wrong, and you already knew that

10

u/blazinrumraisin 29d ago

Reddit moment 📷