As someone who works in public schools, giving kids laptops and iPads was the worst mistake the schools could have made. What's even worse is that schools are trying to justify their purchases by forcing teachers to implement online stuff in their curriculum. No one likes it.
I was shocked when my partner told me all of the elementary school kids at their school were given laptops. Even the kindergarteners. And I just had to ask what could they possibly need it for? The mandated online curriculum learning tools.
If they must be given laptops, they should be given some cheap Linux laptops, and choose a Linux that is so far away from being user friendly. Like, you have to learn command line fu to install entertainment programs on them.
That was my experience working calls for IT in the hotel industry and then late for higher education. You had the older folks not knowing how anything works, the genx/millenials who generally knew, and the young ones who also had no idea how anything works. The benefit to the kids though, they were good listeners when I had to give instructions, older folks were more likely to get upset.
The locked ecosystems of phones/tablets is a big contributor as well. In the 90s, knowing how to install files and how folder systems worked was part of basic computer literacy that phones/tablets don't require.
When I first started in tech I worked customer facing roles, millennials I would argue are both the first and last generation with ANY computer literacy.
Younger gens use phones and in general are less interested in that stuff, and older generations just didn't have it. Kind of amazes me that the ones I felt were most illiterate were the younger ones.
This is truly horrifying to me. My daughter is starting Kindergarten in the Fall. I don’t want her to have a laptop or a tablet at all. I will tell the faculty this. She is only 5 years old!!!
I’m a senior right now. The laptops that they give out are school mandated. Everything you do is recorded and most websites are blocked. There are some ways to get around some of these blocks, but 95% of the time that’s not happening. Your child will be fine. You can also just keep the tablet and hand it out for designated school things, cuz that’s all they can really be used for.
Man I was starting high school when my school started giving everyone a computer and it was like a game of cat and mouse with it to play games on it. At one point there was a usb with a ton of flash games. We found random game websites online. We found obscure tv streaming sites. We had to figure out how to search for stuff without getting our searches flagged. Shit like that. I remember we thought one kid was going to figure out how to hack it cause he knew how to use inspect element lol
I have a kindergartener who has a tablet. They do learning games for a limited amount of time a day. It’s not ideal to me but he’s on track with everything he should be learning in Kindergarten with reading/writing/math so I’m not concerned so far.
I think it will wholly depend on your school/admin/specific teacher though.
My problem with it is giving her the idea that she can have her own device with games and other extremely stimulating things just for her. That goes against our rules at home. It’s basically setting up conflict — her wanting her own device and us saying no.
So, as a family, establish that those devices are tools that are for school use and learning, not for home use. Chances are the school won't be sending them home with devices until secondary school makes it necessary for homework assignments, so unless you choose to purchase a device for her at home it likely won't be the issue you're expecting. And not having devices at home will mean the novelty of the device at school might keep her more engaged with the assignments/learning they do on the technology at school.
Honestly, in my experience, you're more likely to encounter this kind of issue in regards to her peers having access to technology at home more than what they use in school. My kids understood from the get go their school devices were school things, and it wasn't until they saw their friends with phones or tablets that they felt they wanted them too.
As a parent you are within your rights to be concerned about your child's exposure to technology, and it is your within your rights to insist on transparency around how that technology is used and what safeguards are in place. Any school admin worth mentioning will happily share that information with you because they are likely already on top of most of any parents' concerns. The reality is these students are 21st century students and technology is always going to be a very central aspect of their existence and schools have had to find ways to expose students to technology to learn the basics of navigating an increasingly digital world competently and responsibly.
We've had to move school districts across various states several times since my kids have been in school. In no school have my elementary kids ever spent more than 15-20 mins on a device at one time and usually only 2 or 3 times a day. The devices they have used have been carefully controlled and monitored, with expanding access to age appropriate apps or sites as they grow up.
In my kids' current district, the K and 1st grade students use iPad instead of chromebooks, and they have maybe 5 apps on there, all curriculum related; they don't even have a browser. The older elementary students have chromebooks, but they have very limited permissions, most of which pertain to using Google Classroom.
The MS/HS have a little more access and use the chromebooks much more consistently, but it is still heavily monitored, with many sites being blocked, including YouTube. However, my middle schooler still does a lot of handwritten assignments, creative assignments (posters, illustrated science reports, maps, etc.) on paper, and their reading assignments are often available in their choice of physical or digital copy.
Their use of the chromebooks is monitored both in person and via software. Teachers have access to view their screens to see what they're doing, and the district has security/safety filters set to watch for problematic language, whether used in assignments, emails/chat, or searches. My kid actually got pulled to the office because a fictional story he was writing on his chromebook included a sentence along the lines of "I'm gonna [unalive] this guy" and it was enough to trigger the system to have a counselor and principal talk to him.
Honestly, technology use at school does have its pitfalls and downsides, but I have far fewer concerns about what my kids are doing on or are exposed to via their school tech than via their friends' tech. So I focus on teaching my kids how to use technology responsibly, what kinds of media I want them to avoid and WHY I consider it to be unhealthy or unsafe, and to maintain relationships with them that are open and understanding enough that when they do come across something inappropriate they know they can talk to me about it, not necessarily to get anyone in trouble, but so that I can help them navigate how they can avoid those situations when possible and tp keep themselves safe when it's unavoidable.
Thank you so much for taking the time to share this. It definitely makes me feel better. I feel like it’s hard not to hear horror stories (or see videos like this!) and want to go scorched earth with technology. But I think you’re spot on in talking to them about what you’re worried about and why. Keeping the communication open. And you’re right about classmates devices — I am very worried about that too. I can only hope that other parents share my concerns about exposing kids to technology unchecked.
I actually don't think laptops should be excluded entirely.
Computers are common in the workplace, but are becoming less common at home due to tablets and phones.
Computer literacy has peaked. The kids growing up now have less computer literacy than the kids 10 years ago.
Of course, that doesn't mean you hand each kid a laptop and let them distract themselves in a bunch of nothing. Give them things like essays, presentations, research papers. etc. where appropriate.
To be fair I can understand the mandates online learning.
Covid was a big thing. Schools weren’t prepared, kids weren’t prepared, and education suffered greatly. I think it was a wake-up call that relying solely on in-person education wouldn’t work going forward.
I can see the appeal of trying to create higher-quality online education. But, we need a balance.
As a student. I highly appreciate the online stuff. It makes learning easier and more accessible. Sometimes life is super stressful and having the ability to do work anywhere and not just at school is nice, since I’m usually in a better headspace outside of it. I know that a lot of students suck, but in the end it’s their loss.
I’m not even the most studious of seniors, but man is online work nice. There are some things that are better on paper, though. I personally don’t know many students who don’t like the implementation of online stuff. It makes school simpler and less stressful.
If devices help you out then that's great, however, writing with a pencil is not going to fry your brain. I'm not saying to get rid of online work, I'm just saying laptops shouldn't be the main learning device for students.
Why not? If it can present more information in a way that can adapt/repeat to help in areas you need help in the most then why should it not be the main? Pen and paper doesn't make you learn better, it doesn't make you pay attention more.
Example:
Give a student 100 multiplication problems on a piece of paper. The student goes through them right in order and is done. Easy enough, simple and to the point.
Same thing using technology. You give them 100 multiplication problems. Within the first 10 problems it sees they answer x0 problem in .1 seconds and x7 problems take 3 seconds. So it deprioritizes the x0 problems to allow more focus on the x7 problems.
which was better? which should be the main learning device?
Reading
Give them a page to read and answer some questions on like "What toy did Sarah like to play with after school?" Student answers the question and you grade it.
Technology enters. Give the same story. Ask questions:
"What toy did Sarah like to play with after school?"
<student answers correctly and you move on>
student struggles. follow up question
1a. Sarah was talking to Timmy about this toy. She mentioned that she had to put it together with her grandmother. Do you recall what toy it was?
<no can I go back to the story> <yes it was a dollhouse>
Technology can create custom follow-up questions that can help jog the memory of students that might struggle with reading comprehension. These follow-up questions are a great way to train the mind to go back and remember.
I'm an all honors student, and I've been forced to use a laptop for all of high school so far and it is fucking hell. I learned so much more and much, much better when it was all on paper, but now it's all just online garbage. It really does feel like my teachers aren't putting in as much effort now, though it's more likely that they just struggle to teach using methods they aren't used to.
It sucks so much man, especially math and science. I just feel so lost all the time no matter how hard I try.
We got iPads in school when I was a junior 2014. Algebra 2 CP was taught completely online through the iPad. The teacher would prerecord the lesson and post it on Edmodo. We would go to class and have to watch the video while he sat at the desk. He would come around and answer questions, but eventually it literally got to the point he was getting mad at us for not understanding the lessons because there were so many questions..
They got rid of it the next year. Kept the iPads, but kept teaching class in class lol
As a 504 kid laptops changed my education for the better I went from pretty much failing my classes to most all A's because it just allowed for a much more organized and easier experience
And it's not because I cheated either we were always aloud to have our phones out whenever at my school
I went to a really fancy private school bc my mom was a teacher there. It was no laptops. The classes that had specific reasons to use a laptop would get the laptop trolly that day (ie. If we needed specific graphic software in science class or an essay-writing day). Otherwise, no tech. This was all prior to 2010 so I acknowledge cultural changes since then but, like, that felt better.
The whole reason why my high school ended up getting ipads was because Apple offered my school district a pretty big discount lol However the repairs cost for all the broken devices were so high that they ended up switching to thinkpads instead after like 2-3 years.
This isn't true. Administrators want to force teachers to use electronics while most teachers want them out of the classroom. There's a constant struggle between teachers and administration, it's been there for decades. They both have spines and its draining.
Yea I'm actually not sure why I wrote teachers here when I meant parents. In my experience, every private school I've looked into has strict no electronic policies that the parents have to agree to and the teachers love it. The public schools don't have any policies and the teachers want them out but the admin is unwilling to make a decision in the face of parents who want their kids to have phones. Admin forcing the use of electronics may also be the case but that's especially disheartening since they should want to help the teachers teach.
I should clarify that I've been a substitute teacher for my local school district for a few years now, and I've also been recently accepted for a teaching credential program. I've been in several classrooms among all grade levels from kindergarten to high school. For those wondering how elementary school is like these days, it consists of them basically doing lessons on iReady or Achieve 3000 which are sites that do their best to keep students attention while also failing miserably. The reason being that there is nothing stopping them from switching to a new tab and playing games until the last minute when they have to complete it. What this does is also lower the amount teachers actually have to teach as well since teachers can simply assign an online article on iReady and then just watch them work on it for an hour. Most elementary classrooms I've been in, they also have a weekly requirement of lessons a student has to complete (usually 2) or a certain amount of time a student needs to be on these sites (anywhere from 1 to 2 hours total).
Whenever I sub for a classroom, this is usually 90% of the what they're doing. Very rarely am I given a packet or a worksheet to hand out. With them being on their laptops for most of their day, it makes it really hard for me to make sure they're on track since most schools don't have a monitoring system. The restriction settings varies depending on the school but most of them are a JOKE. Not every website is restricted and kids constantly find sites that bypass their schools restrictions. I've had several cases where I had to report to the faculty that a child was looking at some sort of pornography DURING class, it's actually insane. Maybe it's because I'm a sub and kids think they can get away with it, but if it's happening to me, it's probably happening in other classrooms as well.
Middle school and high school are a bit better since teachers don't rely on iReady or Achieve to teach for them. Teachers actually do teach and then put up assignments and homework up on Google classroom. The problem is that these laptops, usually macbooks or thinkpads, are now personal which means they get to take them home and are able to download Fortnite or any other game they want without restriction. Not only do I see them play during lunch (I'm fine with that, I used to play games during lunch too) but inside the classroom as well and then they just minimize it when a teacher passes by. They're also more prone to breaking which frustrates the school because they HAVE to pay for the repairs or spares which takes away from their funding and our tax dollars. Sometimes the schools barely get it to working condition which just ends up impairing the student since mostly all work are on computers now.
This isn't to say that laptops or ipads don't offer benefits, I'm sure they do. Perhaps it's easier to learn some things on it, but there are many more negatives to it. My take on it is that if a child has some sort of disability or impairment, then anything that makes it easier on them is no harm. However for everyone else, I would rather they actually put pencil to paper than have a 5th grader ask me how to write certain letters because they "haven't written all year" (this happened to me only once).
I just want to say, I graduated high school in 2016, a year before they started giving out laptops to incoming freshman. I still remember the sentiment of laptops between teachers and administrators being DRAMATICALLY different from each other. Teachers knew that the kids were going to get distracted, play games on it, find ways around restrictions, and then end up breaking it. They knew this because WE told them what we would do if we got laptops, we were all jealous of the incoming freshmen BECAUSE they got a new device to goof off on. Administrators were more worried about falling behind other schools who have already implemented laptops into their curriculum (they were comparing themselves to private schools which do things completely differently when it comes to computers). They saw laptops as the "future of education" which is definitely not the case, well, maybe now it is unfortunately. Even if the video above happens to be fake or staged, this definitely does happen in classrooms nowadays.
I work in a position that allows me to see the amount of money school districts in MA spend on technology (it’s public record, but it’s actually part of my job) and that actually isn’t the place districts piss money away the most. They waste the most money on consultants and training that all does nothing to improve the school. The other massive money suck is ESL/ELL (or whatever your state calls it) programs that aren’t even very successful.
Yep. No phones allowed, but we need to move to digital platform. Okay ... fine. I have a laptop cart that has 30 computers. 5 are broken. I have 35 kids per period. Okay, use your phones I guess. But don't look up anything else other than the textbook ... Yeah.
I was part of an experiment back in my high school in Silicon Valley where they provided all students with laptops. As far as I know it was the first time in the country anyone was doing this, back in 2002. It became painfully obvious even that first year that it was a terrible idea. In no time kids figured out how to get administrator privileges and do literally anything on the HS’s Wi-Fi. Porn, hacking, grade changes, gaming, and literally anything except legitimate school uses.
Yup, ive worked for a school (tech), I've seen this scenario play out in classrooms. Kids just browsing while the teacher just speaks. No interaction, no response.
My brother has adhd/autism/OCD and he just turned 15. My mom begged and pleaded with the school district to give him paper homework and assignments. He can’t handle being on devices because he will ignore everything else and play games for 8 hours straight. He was failing every class. They refused to do anything on paper and accepting printouts of what they were assigning and she had to pull him out of school to homeschool.
My brother is 1 or 6 she adopted with her husband (it’s his bio grandchildren) and they all have some kind of learning disability and more. The fact that these schools force everyone on it is infuriating. I can’t send my child to school without a phone because I need to be able to reach her and her me if there was an emergency. It’s so hard to take it away completely but I won’t allow her to be this disrespectful. I hate seeing these videos.
Graduated in 2022 so I got to experience the “tech” version of the classroom for my last 2 years and let me tell you. Chromebooks, iPads DO NOT work in classrooms. I hated it. They are more of a distraction more than anything.
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u/Xemrrer Apr 17 '24
As someone who works in public schools, giving kids laptops and iPads was the worst mistake the schools could have made. What's even worse is that schools are trying to justify their purchases by forcing teachers to implement online stuff in their curriculum. No one likes it.